 |
|
CMRT: tank combat seems way off - Printable Version +- Forums (https://www.theblitz.club/message_boards) +-- Forum: The Firing Line (https://www.theblitz.club/message_boards/forumdisplay.php?fid=1) +--- Forum: Combat Mission x2 (https://www.theblitz.club/message_boards/forumdisplay.php?fid=221) +--- Thread: CMRT: tank combat seems way off (/showthread.php?tid=66685) |
RE: CMRT: tank combat seems way off - Steiner14 - 07-14-2014 (07-14-2014, 09:05 PM)Shorker Wrote: Skill level of the units and their HQs.Therefore (+ reproducability and exclusion of parameters) testscenarios are mandatory. RE: CMRT: tank combat seems way off - Weasel - 07-15-2014 No wonder I have given up on CM2. RE: CMRT: tank combat seems way off - A Canadian Cat - 07-15-2014 Oh man. I think you guys are way off base. Sure there might be some things that need tweaking and certainly have been lots of changes to how well tanks spot and the recent bug regarding hull down. But really tank combat plays out pretty well. I just don't think that finding even real issues means things are way off and just be cause your personal favourite gun or tank or your personal pet crappy gun does not behave the way *you* want doesn't make it broken. Remember just because your tankers lost does not make the game broken. When you find stuff wonky go post on BFC's boards and prove it. If you can it will be fixed. Using hyperbole and unsubstantiated statements or asking others to prove a negative doesn't cut the mustard. RE: CMRT: tank combat seems way off - Shorker - 07-15-2014 Well said! 
RE: CMRT: tank combat seems way off - Steiner14 - 07-15-2014 (07-15-2014, 10:25 AM)A Canadian Cat Wrote: I just don't think that finding even real issues means things are way off and just be cause your personal favourite gun or tank or your personal pet crappy gun does not behave the way *you* want doesn't make it broken. Remember just because your tankers lost does not make the game broken.  That's the typical BFC forum yesman attitude. If something is wrong, then "you don't know how to play". Defending until it can't be defended anymore - in the meanwhile customers have stopped playing and will never come back...Quote:When you find stuff wonky go post on BFC's boards and prove it.I guess this was a joke. I was banned a long time ago from their forums, because I disputed the political views spread by the developer. It is a highly unprofessional forum because the game developer spreads his political views but does not accept that they are countered, because it is "his" forum. But a professional attitude is to either allow opposing opinions, or to take an unpoliticial stance. The BFC-forum - probably because of that leading character - is ruled by the worst yesman mentality I ever had experienced on a company forum. But it's even worse: the mentality is so extremely unprofessional, that he wrote me a PM, where he bragged that he would have studied history and therefore was correct, and when I wanted to reply, I was already banned. This behaviour in German is called "nachtreten" - to put the boot in? It wouldn't put much weight on it, but by looking at the overall picture of the fanoy and yesmen mentality the BFC-forum has turned into, then things are quite obvious. This began to develop for the worse with CMSF. I left for several years, because I couldn't find anything interesting in slaughtering chanceless forces, and when I came back with the release of CMBN, the audience and mentality of the forum had changed dramatically. The nice and open minded CMx1-atmosphere was gone, while a sneaky and narrow minded atmosphere was present. I will never forget, when CMSF came out, how Steve allowed the most stupid and rude posts against Arab people, while on the other hand he was censoring what was contradicting US propaganda lies. Maybe they hoped to get a contract with the DOD?  And your reaction is quite typical for the BFC mentality since: "We are right. Raising a problem is not enough for us to look at it, YOU must prove it." While you already have decided it was only "because your tankers lost". I'm sure you did not even download the testscenarios I provided. I can tell you, it's not because I was losing, but in fact because I'm a perfectionist and if something goes wrong, I search for a solution until I have found one. Therefore the result is, that I'm a quite decent player. But if real world tactics are not honored, and gamey tricks therefore are used, what do you guess, will be the result in the long term for such a game? This arrogant attitude of mediocre players is one of the reasons why CMx2 is getting no foot on the ground anymore: yesmen mentality and arrogant fanbois are defending, what good and open minded players recognize much earlier. How long did the whole beta-circle not recognize that spotting of tanks was not working correctly? I had sent BFC my findings soon after CMBN was released. And at that time the fanboi brigade had played CMSF for years already and noticed nothing. Yes, that's one of the problems: the mediocrity of the yesmen has driven most of the good people away. What I find symptomatic for this mentality: You did not even ask me what the gamey trick for tank combat was, I mentioned. Because you have given yourself the answer already: players that critizice the game do this, because they cannot play... RE: CMRT: tank combat seems way off - A Canadian Cat - 07-15-2014 (07-15-2014, 10:41 PM)Steiner14 Wrote: Well you can set me up in a straw man and knock me down. Your post is full of hyperbole with no evidence to back it up (not game tests real world analysis). You basically expect BFC and others to prove a negative. I have better things to do with my time.  (07-15-2014, 10:41 PM)Steiner14 Wrote: I'm sure you did not even download the testscenarios I provided. Correct - see last sentence. (07-15-2014, 10:41 PM)Steiner14 Wrote: This arrogant attitude of mediocre players is one of the reasons why CMx2 is getting no foot on the ground anymore: yesmen mentality and arrogant fanbois are defending, what good and open minded players recognize much earlier. Oh, nice personal now. I am sure we would all prefer it if you left it at that. I am sure I am a mediocre player but I assure you I am not arrogant. (07-15-2014, 10:41 PM)Steiner14 Wrote: What I find symptomatic for this mentality: Ouch. I have no interest in gamey tricks. I'm going back to playing. My opponents will be wanting more turns so they can all finish beating me soundly 
RE: CMRT: tank combat seems way off - ARCH - 07-16-2014 Well that escalated rather quickly. Here I am trying to do some research on tank maneuvering and I stumble upon this gem. In what way, shape, or form is crying "CM2 fanboys" or "that's why I don't play this anymore" going to help? I'm still pretty new to this community but one thing I've noticed is its not that big. If its a bug (Which it most likely could be) then lets take it straight to Battlefront, I can even help somehow. But just plain giving up, or bringing up personal feuds with a company and its fanbase isn't going to get very far. Hope this works out. RE: CMRT: tank combat seems way off - Steiner14 - 07-16-2014 (07-16-2014, 05:33 AM)ARCH Wrote: In what way, shape, or form is crying "CM2 fanboys" or "that's why I don't play this anymore" going to help?If you would have read before posting, you would know that I argued my observations and I even offered test setups for download. Quote:If its a bug (Which it most likely could be) then lets take it straight to Battlefront, I can even help somehow. Yes, for example you could send a ticket to the helpdesk and hope it will be solved in one, two or three years.  Or you could post in the forum and receive the typical fanboi behaviour that "you are only frustrated for losing your tanks" and you "must apply proper tactics" and if you kiss enough asses and praise BFC enough, and offer undeniable evidence, then maybe they would deem it worth to take a closer look.  Because of this discussion I visited their forums today and it's funny that one immediately stumbles over the everything ruling fanboism: Customers complain that there was no information about the progress of the next patch and ofcourse the fanboi brigade is there to excuse it with "they are busy", or "time they spend on the forum, they cannot develop the game" and the old BFC all time classic of "it's ready when it's ready". I still find it fascinating to observe how they act that hostile against their own interests as customers - and ofcourse also act against the interests of the other customers. Fans can't differ between the different agendas of the seller and the customer, because they have made the agenda of their idol to their own agenda. So please stop posting BS here. Either you have something to contribute to the discussion of hulldown behaviour, then you're welcome, or please go away. RE: CMRT: tank combat seems way off - A Canadian Cat - 07-16-2014 (07-16-2014, 06:50 AM)Steiner14 Wrote: I still find it fascinating to observe how they act that hostile against their own interests as customers - and ofcourse also act against the interests of the other customers. Fans can't differ between the different agendas of the seller and the customer, because they have made the agenda of their idol to their own agenda. I read the same postings and did not take it that way at all. I disagree with your conclusions. You clearly have a different point of view - fine that is the way of life. But do me a favour and stop calling people names - some of us might have trouble keeping our cool. I reread this thread just to be sure. The first post about hull down issues sounds pretty much like the defect that was presented to BFC and they acknowledged the problem (actually two) which another poster pointed out. So that is covered. Then you made a totally unsubstantiated statement about a particular gun. When I say unsubstantiated I mean no comparison between real world sources and in game testing (I mean testing of the gun not hull down). So you found a bug that has already been acknowledged and is being worked on. And you made a random claim about a particular gun. I am sorry but I fail to see how that reaches the bar for tank combat being way off. Remember calling me names is not a substitute for supporting your arguments. RE: CMRT: tank combat seems way off - Weasel - 07-16-2014 Hey guys, make sure you keep this a discussion and don't turn it into a personal issue. The hull down makes total sense to me now, you may remember a while back I posted that my PzIVs sucked, they were hull down (HMMM) and a Sherman (s) moved up to them (it happened several times in the game) and blasted them with no return fire. The only kill I got was when I was sitting on a hill on a road and a Sherman was spotted in a field advancing below me. My last hull down PzIV was covering a hedge, facing, and still was blind to the yankee shooting at him, even when the rounds bounced at first.. I just don't find the game fun right now and at this point in time I am sorry I wasted $$ on it. BTW - I am ex-armoured so yes I try to do the real world tricks and tactics I learned, but they don't work in this game. |
){kind=link}