Musket and Pike Series oddities - Printable Version

Musket and Pike Series oddities - Printable Version

+- Forums (https://www.theblitz.club/message_boards)
+-- Forum: The Firing Line (https://www.theblitz.club/message_boards/forumdisplay.php?fid=1)
+--- Forum: Black Powder & Cold Steel (https://www.theblitz.club/message_boards/forumdisplay.php?fid=163)
+---- Forum: Musket & Pike (https://www.theblitz.club/message_boards/forumdisplay.php?fid=166)
+---- Thread: Musket and Pike Series oddities (/showthread.php?tid=74145)

Musket and Pike Series oddities - TheGrayMouser - 12-09-2020

Couple things I noticed lately

Renaissance:
The no detached melee rule introduced not only in 7 years war but also the Nap titles is NOT optional in Ren.... Very odd especially since many of the scenarios have very loose or barely existent structures which makes the rule somewhat awkward for across the board. Request a change to the engine for it to be to be optional!!

7 Years War:
All the cavalry in the OOB's that I have looked at (apart from the Indian cavalry in the expansion scenario pack which are correct) appear to be mis-coded.

as an example they are coded as "zero" in the last data line as such(bolded):

U 100 3 H S 110 7 0 0 24 11 0 1/Royal Etranger

This just means they wont suffer the "assault penalty" that cavalry are supposed to have when meleeing into trenches and out of abatis hexes. However, all cavalry should be coded as "4"

There are a few scenarios that features trenches and abattis so it should be changed next patch.

For those interested ( the "notes" are not 100% correct) these are what that code line produces for in game effects

for infantry
0 can form line and column ( only)
1 can form line, column and block
2 can form column ( only)
3 can form column and block only ( hard coded in Ren and possibly in 7YW that such a unit cannot initiate melee in column and since block cannot melee occupied bridges or gates, in effect such units (which are pikes in Ren) cannot fight their way across a bridge or into a town gate held by a single 5 man skirmisher!...) Hopefully this can be tweeked someday!!

for cavalry
4 cavalry only code, gives assault penalties in trench or abattis, the penalty value set by the PDT for that scenario.

Graphics: Both games 3d graphics for units are slightly "off" so you can see relics from the neighboring graphic file in the hex. A modder has recently fixed the issue for Ren and its in the d/l's section.

JTS hopefully can make the fix official for both games

Cheers!

RE: Musket and Pike Series oddities - Gary McClellan - 12-09-2020

I'll have to look at the Cav issue more carefully, but with the movement and melee disruptions involved with abatis hexes, it would be redundant to have that in there. I'll test it in regards to trenches.

RE: Musket and Pike Series oddities - Gary McClellan - 12-09-2020

(Oh, BTW, I've made the other M&P devs aware of this, including the Rich White with REN, so we'll talk about it on that end, and see if they think I'm even more nuts than usual.)

RE: Musket and Pike Series oddities - Gary McClellan - 12-10-2020

I've done some testing on the Cav issue and bounced it off of Rich White and others, and here is where we sit at the moment.

The 4 tag for cavalry oob is something that was added in REN, but SYW added a rule for melee pre-disruption. If a unit melees across (say a stream) or into (say a trench) a terrain feature that causes disruption, that unit is given the melee penalty for being disrupted. So, for a defending unit in a trench, you're already stacking the D penalty and the trench penalty.

To give the Cav units the penalty you mention would be simple overkill.

(The REN command issues are Rich White's territory to look at. He's been made aware of the comment.)

RE: Musket and Pike Series oddities - TheGrayMouser - 12-10-2020

(12-10-2020, 02:49 AM)Gary McClellan Wrote: I've done some testing on the Cav issue and bounced it off of Rich White and others, and here is where we sit at the moment.

The 4 tag for cavalry oob is something that was added in REN, but SYW added a rule for melee pre-disruption. If a unit melees across (say a stream) or into (say a trench) a terrain feature that causes disruption, that unit is given the melee penalty for being disrupted. So, for a defending unit in a trench, you're already stacking the D penalty and the trench penalty.

To give the Cav units the penalty you mention would be simple overkill.

(The REN command issues are Rich White's territory to look at. He's been made aware of the comment.)

Thanks Gary, by that logic, Rich might have some OOB coding to do as the Ren. patch 1.05 added the same "pre melee disruption" as 7YW. ;) ie "Melee across a hexside or into a hex that would cause Disorder results in the same Melee penalty as if the unit was Disordered"