N44 - beyond the beaches

[LBouton]

To supplement the discussion on bunker busting, I wonder if players have views on life after the beaches. The games I've played, both allies and axis, both alt and stock, all have the allies advancing much more rapidly that historically, with the germans getting ground to a pulp. Is this a common experience?

If so, does it suggest that defense in the bocage need to be tweaked even higher? Or perhaps recovery rates for the axis raised?

Larry

[Bushido]

Sir,

I don't follow the crying about the bunker's at all. It is only sound
and good tactic that the german's stack them to max.
Really that would everybody do wouldn't they?

I look at the PZC series as games, but based on military history.
Not military simulations like you ask for.

I don't see no need that they always should follow in detail the
historical outcome. Or operational progress if you like that better.

[LBouton]

I'm not insisting that the game should exactly mirror historical outcome, rather I think of the historical outcome as the benchmark. If the germans were able to hold ground much more effectively historically that I or other players have been able to, then it suggests that some tweaking to the game might be called for.

Larry

[Mike Bowen]

Also its a bit like sex the longer it lasts the better it is for both parties.

Besides its nice not to get wiped off the map too soon.

Mike

[Peter777]

I like PZC when it is close to History.

Beyond the beaches action in N44 seem better under Ed's changes, but it needs some fine tuning.

The last N44 Anvil of victory results are interesting to look at.

#11 NORMANDY-2_ALT.SCN BRIDGEHEAD BATTLE
20 TURNS
Gents here are the scores for the first scenario

Where 4600 is a Minor Victory

ALLIED
Hog of War-5029
Peter777-4678
Volcano Man-4947
David B. Brown-5150

AXIS
Baelfiin--75
Heinz-3635
Sgt. Barker-3335
Sgt. Fury-462

[Baelfiin]

Remember that version for the tournament above is not the same as how the scenario is now. The version used for the ANVIL tourny had some stronger defences at OMAHA and also did not have the fixed radio unit. There are now better defenses inland and a few more garrison troops inland.

[Volcano Man]

Yes, Baelfiin is correct. I made the changes after the tourney began and I made the changes in direct response to play results from the tourney.

[Krak]

Sir,

I look at the PZC series as games, but based on military history.
Not military simulations like you ask for.

I don't see no need that they always should follow in detail the
historical outcome. Or operational progress if you like that better.

I agree. These are games to be played and enjoyed. I don't want to get bogged down with perfect historical outcomes. As long as its within the realm of possibility and within reason thats fine with me.

[Aetius]

A few minor notes about this campaign:
A-C Inf / 17th Royal Canadian Hussars from 3rd Canadian Division has 90 vehicles as base strength instead of the 90 men of the same units in every other Commonwealth Division;

82nd Airborne and 101st Airborne are not withdrawn in the 750 turn campaign. In the stock campaign they are so on July 1st. From what I could read the 101st was sent to garrison Cherbourg after its fall in late June, then shipped to England; 82nd Airborne participated in the first phases of the VIII corps offensive toward La Haye du Puits starting July 3rd, then shipped to England.

1st and 2nd Wing of the Glider Pilot Regt could also be removed from play early in the game: glider pilots had orders to head for the beaches as soon as practical, and actually carried a signed order from Eisenhower to that effect. Many did so in the days following the landings.

I would like to add that I would be playing chess were not for the efforts of the designers to make these games in particular as accurate as they possibly can.

Rui

[Volcano Man]

Aetius, thanks for the info. I will make the corrections for the next update.