Tank Assaults

[Capt. G]

In ES, are there any general rules of understanding regarding tanks assualting infantry?

[Jeff Conner]

Captain G:

In ES, tanks (really any AFV with an armor value greater than the AFV value set in the PDT file, usually set at about 20) are very effective in assaulting infantry. The opposite is not true, infantry assaulting tanks is a huge waste of resources. Your best result will be if you fail the morale check. For vehicles with armor values less than the AFV value, the results are a little less clear. At this level, however, infantry has a much better chance in both scenarios. In my experience, a tank with an armor value of 15 has about a 50:50 chance of surviving an assault with an infantry squad. A halftrack or armored car with an armor value of 8 has even less. There are lots of other variables to be included here including who is attacking, the weapons involved etc, but this is kind of a rough estimate.

The other consideration in ES and most of the other SB games is that a vehicle assaulting into covered terrain stands a rather significant chance of being immobilized. This can result in either the attacker's or the defender's hex depending on the defender's morale check results. This type of assault is usually only a good choice if the gain is worth the risk.

I did a test one time with several different German AFVs against an American squad, with both sides as assaulters. With a sample size of ten, the infantry did not damage a Mark IV or anything heavier. If I can find the results, I will try and post them here in this topic. That said, I have seen vehicles in the Mark IV class destroyed making assaults, but it is pretty rare.

[Capt. G]

Thanks for the response.

I guess I'm asking if between players, tank assaults on infantry are 'ok' or not

[keif149]

Having been ground into the dust on many occasions, I have no objections and there are none from those I play! :)

[hero_33]

Ditto,

When it happens in an email game I get the feeling it isn't fair, but I bet the soldiers who were really there thaught it sucked too when the panzer turned the corner after them. I think using them in assaults is acurate and fair.

Great post too Jeff. nice depth to a subject I have thought about but makes more sense now.

Steve.

[Jeff Conner]

Gentlemen:

I have played occasionally with an informal rule that tanks should not assault troops in improved positions as the results are too severe. However, like all informal rules, these should be agreed to before the game starts and can cause more discontent than they resolve. I have never heard anyone complain about vehicle assaults in open ground. Sometimes it just plain sucks to be in the infantry.

Jeff

[Dazooz]

Wasn't the possibility of immobilization and/or destruction increased greatly in patches for armor assaulting covered/improved positions without infantry?

[Jeff Conner]

Gentlemen:

One of the last patches to Eagle Strike and all of the other Squad Battles patches that came afterwards did increase the chance for immobilization of a vehicle assaulting into covered terrain. Covered terrain is marked by a "C" in brackets after the terrain's name in the terrain box (there may be other letters in the brackets also indicating other effects for that terrain type). It does not make any difference if the vehicle is accompanied by infantry during the assault (at least that is what my experience shows). Improved positions do not make any difference, the calculation being determined by the underlying terrain. The percentage chance for immobilization is listed in the pdt file.

Hope this helps.

Jeff

[Dazooz]

Indeed!
Thank you Jeff!

[Vilhjalmr]

I was hoping to get a little further clarification about tank assaults against infantry (in AotR). Earlier in this thread, Jeff Conner mentioned a common informal rule is that tanks should not assault troops in improved positions. Does that just mean terrain that specifically is labeled “improved” or does it also include pillboxes, trenches and bunkers?

What raised the question for me is in the 410628-Wielke Dzial “Assault on Wielke Dzial” scenario, the only way that tanks can get behind enemy lines is to cross through one of those types of terrains. They do not have the “improved” label on them, but I would tend to think of them as such. So basically my question is should tanks be allowed to assault infantry in those types of terrains or should tanks only traverse those types of terrains if there aren’t any infantry in them?

And if the latter, what happens if there are infantry in a couple of consecutive trenches and/or the tank gets somewhat boxed in such that the tank really has to go out of its way to avoid assaulting the infantry’s position?

I am relatively new to the game and looking to start PBEM’ing against a couple of my friends who are also just learning the game. I would like to figure out the fairest guideline for this since I am sure this type of situation will eventually arise. Thanks in advance.