Recon Spotting question

[FM WarB]

I have noticed some "recon" units cannot perform recon spotting with the optional rule checked. I suspect it is because these units were not set up properly in the oob editor.
What are the oob editor defined reqirements for a unit to have recon spotting capability? Can such a unit be infantry, of any type? What are the component, unit class and unit type requirements to make recon spotting capable units?

[Ricky B]

I believe the only requirement is to have the unit type set to recon, simply enough. So no, it can't be infantry - not sure what "of any type" means as infantry is the unit type in its case. If the unit type is not recon, then I don't believe there is anything you can do to make it "recon". A recon in the unit name definitely isn't enough to give it recon ability.

The designer creates the component types so no impact there, a component is just a saved set of unit settings and ratings. The unit class is basically a movement/target classification with no impact on abilities unrelated to movement and targeting, basically.

Rick

[FM WarB]

So A unit Class Moterized of unit Type Recon would be Men? I should state that much consideration (ie. how good was commo equipment and recon doctrine) should be given before having alot of recon spotting capable units in a scenario.
WB (an ex Armored cav plt ldr)

[Glenn Saunders]

[FM WarB]

Glenn,
Some German Aufklaerung cos, which could dismount were mounted in Sdkfz 9's and 10's, which are hard half tracks. If they are unit Type Recon, and unit Class hard halftrack, that makes them vehicles, not men, if I understand your last post correctly.
Other German recon troops rode on Kuebelwagens, motorcycles, horses, bicycles, and who knows what all else. And there are jeep mounted US recon units (unit class motorized). These types all can dismount.
Learning exactly how to set up recon spotting capable units is interesting to me, as I think the recon capabilities of the opposing sides, set as well as possible can have some influence on a scenario. I also believe that units that can dismount are better at sneeking and peeking than vehiclular units.
Warren

[Glenn Saunders]

Learning exactly how to set up recon spotting capable units is interesting to me, as I think the recon capabilities of the opposing sides, set as well as possible can have some influence on a scenario.

Make the Unit Type RECON and it will be Recon - nothing more than that. I don't exect there will be any further enhancements to how it is now.

Glenn

[Dog Soldier]

FM WarB wrote:

I also believe that units that can dismount are better at sneeking and peeking than vehiclular units.

I am not so sure this is true when the terrain is open like the desert or the Russian Steppe.

The recon unit would have to return to report what it knows, not a problem in this game system. I would like to see a condition that the recon unit has to be in command to actually report what it sees.

The best defense against recon is using partols to kill the enemy recon.

Dog Soldier

[FM WarB]

I'd like to relate a personal experience, which although I was not in danger of being shot at, was simulating it, as best the US army could, at the time.
As a cavalry platoon leader in 1977 in Germany (6 Sheridans, 2 M113 scout tracks, 1 M113 4.2 mortar track, and an M113 "command" track which I rarely rode in) I was driving down a wooded hilly road, about to turn a bend and break into the open. I dismounted a scout section, sent them up a hill to peek at the valley below, before proceeding with my vehicles. A wise recon tactic, which took some time.
Note that in this cavalry platoon, a direct derivitive of the WWII cav platoon (Sheridans replacing M8 armored cars) I had no concept of using the Sheridans as scouts.
EagleHorse!!!...lol

[Dog Soldier]

I think simulating the actions of a dismounted section are beyond the scope of the HPS games. In this game LOS is simple. If we see you, you can see us.

I would also point out the obvious...if you had been spotted by the enemy, it does not matter if you dismount and go on foot or are still in your vehicle. So luck is a factor. Luck was, in your example, the area you were in when you stopped was not being observed from some where else.

If it had been, and you came under fire, waiting to retrieve the dismounted troops would then become a factor of how far away from the vehicles they were when the enemy fire landed. Abandoning them would depend on if they were the first hit and gone, if they were still viable and could be retrieved, or if the vehicles were being targeted.

If the choice was to stay and retrieve the dismounts, then the risk would be possibly taking more damage to the entire platoon.

The Sheridans would be quite vulnerable, sitting still, until they cranked up and got moving to avoid the incoming fire. So, you see, luck has something to do with anything in war and a soldier does his best and trusts to his luck.

In the game you can bump some recon troops on motorcycles in T mode right up against a strong enemy position and nothing happened. Other times they are ambushed ans slaughtered. I think the random results and range of results provides a good feel for the operational scale.

What actually happened in the hex for any type of outcome is up to your imagination.

Dog Soldier

[Dog Soldier]

I could also mention that losing a single vehicle in an encounter would be the same as losing it's dismounted crew that went to go take a peek.

Dog Soldier