Air and Artillery by the Map Optional Rule for D85

[Elxaime]

Hi -

I have not usually used the optional rule for artillery and airstrikes to be plotted by map, but thinking of doing so for D85. Any opinions on this? If possible can people give their thoughts on two questions:

1. Is this optional rule more in line with the real-world capabilities of the armed forces involved on the two sides? In other words, if you want to more accurately model capabilities, should the optional rule be enabled?

2. In terms of the game, what are the consequences? How does this change tactics? Is it potentially unbalancing? What countermeasures can be taken? Are there some potentially gamey issues to watch out for?

Thanks in advance.

[FLG]

I haven't found this unbalancing at all. It is possible to try to interdict choke points using it. Recon the appropriate area and then bring in the strike. This was a common tactic used in in WWII never mind this day and age. It's just a form of focused interdiction.

As it is, I play WP in DF85 and they get so few attack missions I don 't have time to waste them on hunting for targets in the rear, there is usually enough directly in front of me.

I have kept meaning to ask, why do the soviets get so few air missions?

[Al]

From my experience, it is very realistic to use this rule as Artillery of this time was quite capable of doing this. It is best used, as FLG said, to target choke points using artillery mines & chemicals.

[Volcano Man]

The only issue with balance is that by selecting this it basically allows all artillery to be massed and used with equal effectiveness regardless of their organization. In a MC game this can be very deadly.

[FLG]

I have always assumed that art fire by map, as opposed to firing on a hex spotted by your own formation, would count as firing on a hex spotted by a detached unit, even if the spotter is attached to his own unit. If so the fire is half as effective.

[Elxaime]

I have always assumed that art fire by map, as opposed to firing on a hex spotted by your own formation, would count as firing on a hex spotted by a detached unit, even if the spotter is attached to his own unit. If so the fire is half as effective.

Is this the case? Can someone confirm this?

[Volcano Man]

Good point, at least it used to be the way I described but it might very well be different with the new HQ / detachment rules. I admit that I have not played it with this optional rule since the changes were made.

[Elxaime]

The only issue with balance is that by selecting this it basically allows all artillery to be massed and used with equal effectiveness regardless of their organization. In a MC game this can be very deadly.

I guess then brings up three related questions.

1. If this optional rule allows massed artillery targeting as you describe, is this an accurate and realistic portrayal of what modern artillery can do? Is such a doctrine and capability appropriate to the NATO and Pact armies?

2. On the strict question of balance, does it make sense to enable the arty setup optional rule as a counterweight?

3. Is there any reason NOT to use the arty setup rule? e.g. is it regarded as less realistic?

Thanks in advance, especially from any artillery experts.

[Aaron]

I dont remember exact words but fire value is cut in half when firing on a hex not spotted. Ive always used the rule and never had any problems with it, and i also use it mostly to drop some art mines on choke points, and as far as massing ART im not sure how many units u consider massing,4,10,20? I dont know about u but ive never had 20 ART units that could fire on the same hex, and if i wanted to i would be moving ART out of other areas and making them weaker with no artillery support. On the other hand if i did have 20 units in one area and directed them all on one hex why not, its been done threw out history massing artillery before a major offensive.

Aaron

[Al]

The only issue with balance is that by selecting this it basically allows all artillery to be massed and used with equal effectiveness regardless of their organization. In a MC game this can be very deadly.

In my opinion, the primary use of the optional rule is like I already said; indiction with artillery mines & chemicals. Although, if enough artillery was in range & a target indentified by whatever means massed artillery would be very effective.

1. If this optional rule allows massed artillery targeting as you describe, is this an accurate and realistic portrayal of what modern artillery can do? Is such a doctrine and capability appropriate to the NATO and Pact armies?

I think so, although I believe that NATO was more sophisticated in it's targeting means & methods.

2. On the strict question of balance, does it make sense to enable the arty setup optional rule as a counterweight?

3. Is there any reason NOT to use the arty setup rule? e.g. is it regarded as less realistic?

I have witnessed even towed artillery set up & firing within the equivalent of a MC game turn.

Balance versus realism is always a tricky issue. My own personal preference is realism & I consider artillery setup OFF and targeting by the map ON as most realistic. Your mileage may vary.