Tank accuracy...

[Der Kuenstler]

I was curious if a tank would fire less accurately when the commander was killed. I set up a scenario and have three Panzer IVHs lined up. The one on the left has had its commander killed by a sniper. The one in the middle is just buttoned, and the one on the right is unbuttoned. All three crews are veteran. After having a Sherman pass into their sights, I checked the hit chance for all three - it was identical. So the loss of the tank commander does not reduce its accuracy at all.



Afterwards I ordered all three IVHs to area fire and all three got off eight rounds, so apparently losing the commander does not affect reload times either.

[Mikey_FGM]

So the loss of the tank commander does not reduce its accuracy at all.

Interesting.

Losing the commander DEFINETLY reduces spotting ability though...

So it seems the best thing to do with headless tanks is to throw them in a pack, and let Borg spotting be their eyes...

[Joonny]

I think it doesn't matter for the PzIV as they have a 3-man turret (i think) ie a tank commander and then a seperate loader and gunner. If a tank has a 2-man turret losing the tank commander should in theory lose accuracy if the tank CO is taken out.

From the manual:

1 man turret - some early war tank models with a crew of 2
have only one man in the turret - meaning that the tank commander
is usually also the gunner and loader, and therefore cannot remain
unbuttoned and fire the tank's main armament at the same time.
This greatly diminishes a tank's spotting abilities while firing and
affects rate of fire and accuracy also, as the tank commander has to
reload by himself and therefore is forced to take his eye off the sight
for each shot.

So if the tank is reduced to one man inside the turret the gunner will also have to reload and thus affects ROF and accuracy.

[jawsconan]

Hi,

Interesting test, DK.
Finally, a tank leader is only efficient to improve tank's self ability to spot enemy units when it is totally isolated ; i mean when there are not friendly units (infantry, snipers) around to help it with spotting task.
Thanks for the test.

cheers
Jawsconan.

[Der Kuenstler]

So if the tank is reduced to one man inside the turret the gunner will also have to reload and thus affects ROF and accuracy.

Didn't think about that - OK time for another test - but those tanks that your quote refers to (2 man) can't fire at all if the commander is killed, right?

[Joonny]

I'm fairly sure the can after all they have 1 man turrets, obviously if he gets killed in a 1 man turret, well then the tanks a bit screwed lol.

[Der Kuenstler]

Here I've lined up three Stug IIIGs which have a crew of FOUR instead of the crew of five that the Panzers above have. Joonny appears right - the Stug with the killed commander has a 2% less hit chance than the other two vehicles.



Yet these 251/9s that have a crew of THREE all have the exact same hit chance, even though the first one has his commander killed.

[Soldier]

I would think that in the first case (Panzer IVHs) the panzer with commander exposed, should have the highest hit ratio, next highest should be with the commander buttoned up and last the one with commander killed.

Reasoning being, tank gunners don't hit their target on the very first shot, unless the range is very short or occasional luck involved.
I would reason that the commander can see the missed shots and call corrections for fallow up shots much better than the gunner himself can do.
I'm not even sure if the gunner can see or even judge very accurately as to whether his shot was to short or overshot the intended target.
What do you think??

[Der Kuenstler]

I don't know enough about it myself. But it would be interesting to do a test with one tank and see if its hit % improves after each missed shot...

[Ratzki]

I am pretty sure that it does.