Bridge building: Panzer Campaigns

[jonnymacbrown]

This is actually not correct.

below is right for the DOCs

"When an Engineer unit has less than 100 men, the probability of completing the bridge is reduced proportionally. In addition, an engineer company will have a probability of bridge completion 1/3 that of an engineer battalion. Otherwise, having more than one Engineer unit constructing a bridge will increase the chances of completion."

So you it is up to you is you want ONE chance at the normal rate or 3 chances at 1/3 the normal rate.

Also note there is a Quality Modifier so better Eng take longer to build then poorer engs.

FWIW Guys - we did a lot of work during PzC Bulge 44 on how long it takes to build bridges vs the ENg unit size and quality. So while it seems like the Bridge takes forever, statistically for the Germans crossing the Our RIver at thr start of thr Bulge Campaign, your bridges will generally be completed more quickly than they were built historically.

Thanks Glenn. However it is, it seemed to me that my chances were greatly increased, and it sure seemed to go smoother, when I built bridges with companies. But mathematically, I think it actually is better to take 3 chances at anything rather than 1. jonny

[Dog Soldier]

"So you mean in the command menu just break the unit down?"

Correct. American E units don't break down but Germans do. That's a big help. I got slowed down trying to cross the Meuse (what German commander hasn't?) by building bridges with one large E unit. I thought that bigger was better. In this case it isn't: three smaller companies will build the bridge faster than one large unit. jonny

It really depends on the tactical situation at the bridge site. Any unit, battalion or co. with quality E will take a long time to build.

If quality is the same, then one must consider if the engineers can be fired at by the enemy and how much fire will come down on the engineers. Companies gain fatigue faster and thus can be disrupted or shot to lose a level of quality, reducing the 1/3 chance a company has compared to a battalion. That has to be weighed against having three unit trying instead of all your eggs in the "battalion bucket" so to speak.

Quality of engineers is the biggest factor in getting a bridge up.

Dog Soldier

[jonnymacbrown]

"Quality of engineers is the biggest factor in getting a bridge up."

That's interesting news. I guess those Waffen SS Eng. units get the job done very well. Do you know the % increase due to quality?

In the Ardennes, American Eng. units are blowing bridges rather than building them and that seems to succeed very well, almost 100% of the time. jonny :smoke:
jonny

[BluntF]

Looking in the manual it looks like :

A = 120
B 110 of normal
C normal
D 75% of normal
E 50% of normal
F 25 % of normal

Page 48

[Rev Rico]

After building a bridge with a combined battalion, break it down and only one company stays to maintain the bridge; the rest can move on.

Bob

[Dog Soldier]

In the Ardennes, American Eng. units are blowing bridges rather than building them and that seems to succeed very well, almost 100% of the time. jonny :smoke:
jonny

Destroying bridges is a combination of the quality, number of men, and assault factor of the engineer unit.

A bridge engineer left behind to blow the bridge might not do the job with an assault factor of three.
Give the task to an assault engineer with an assault factor 18. Those guys love to blow things up.

Dog Soldier

[cazart!]

On the bridging coys vs bats, using bats will always be more effective.

Example: There is a 30% chance to build a bridge.

A battalion will fail 70% of the time. 3 coy will each have a 10% chance. The chance that all will fail is 72.9% (0.90 x 0.90 x 0.90)

This is in addition to fatigue issues, etc inherent in operating as a company.

[jeffro]

"Never did get that bridge built."
What you need to do is break down the Eng. unit into component companies and build with 3 units instead on 1. A single Eng. unit no matter how large will take a long time to build a bridge, ergo, use companies. This isn't gamesmanship but is rather a game feature. An Eng. unit being harassed by fire will not affect the bridge construction, only disruption will do that. You should be able to deconstruct the bridge and later build another one with the same unit. jonny

This is actually not correct.

below is right for the DOCs

"When an Engineer unit has less than 100 men, the probability of completing the bridge is reduced proportionally. In addition, an engineer company will have a probability of bridge completion 1/3 that of an engineer battalion. Otherwise, having more than one Engineer unit constructing a bridge will increase the chances of completion."

So you it is up to you is you want ONE chance at the normal rate or 3 chances at 1/3 the normal rate.

Also note there is a Quality Modifier so better Eng take longer to build then poorer engs.

FWIW Guys - we did a lot of work during PzC Bulge 44 on how long it takes to build bridges vs the ENg unit size and quality. So while it seems like the Bridge takes forever, statistically for the Germans crossing the Our RIver at thr start of thr Bulge Campaign, your bridges will generally be completed more quickly than they were built historically.

Glenn

So multiple Battalions would be the best then? Thanks for all the help everyone that replied. Interesting stuff. Looks like my lame bridge attempt with about 160 men was really piss poor idea ha ha! I attached a screenshot of who I used

I learned this hard way as well! If some is good, more is better...at least fro bridge building!

[jonnymacbrown]

"Never did get that bridge built."
What you need to do is break down the Eng. unit into component companies and build with 3 units instead on 1. A single Eng. unit no matter how large will take a long time to build a bridge, ergo, use companies. This isn't gamesmanship but is rather a game feature. An Eng. unit being harassed by fire will not affect the bridge construction, only disruption will do that. You should be able to deconstruct the bridge and later build another one with the same unit. jonny

This is actually not correct.

below is right for the DOCs

"When an Engineer unit has less than 100 men, the probability of completing the bridge is reduced proportionally. In addition, an engineer company will have a probability of bridge completion 1/3 that of an engineer battalion. Otherwise, having more than one Engineer unit constructing a bridge will increase the chances of completion."

So you it is up to you is you want ONE chance at the normal rate or 3 chances at 1/3 the normal rate.

Also note there is a Quality Modifier so better Eng take longer to build then poorer engs.

FWIW Guys - we did a lot of work during PzC Bulge 44 on how long it takes to build bridges vs the ENg unit size and quality. So while it seems like the Bridge takes forever, statistically for the Germans crossing the Our RIver at thr start of thr Bulge Campaign, your bridges will generally be completed more quickly than they were built historically.

Glenn

So multiple Battalions would be the best then? Thanks for all the help everyone that replied. Interesting stuff. Looks like my lame bridge attempt with about 160 men was really piss poor idea ha ha! I attached a screenshot of who I used

I learned this hard way as well! If some is good, more is better...at least fro bridge building!

Statistically and mathmatically you are better off with 3 chances @ 1/3 rate than one chance @ full rate. Also a 160 man C rated Eng. battalion usually builds a bridge pretty quickly. An A rated Eng. battalion of any size will build a bridge quickly.  jonny

[Mr Grumpy]

Also remember that assuming you do complete a bridge, the bridge engineer unit stuck maintaining it can then still dig in, once you have a TRENCH in that hex it will provide a defensive benefit to the engineer and any other unit in the hex.

Of course during the bridge building period other units can dig in to provide a defensive benefit and try to prevent the bridge engineer being disrupted.