Minsk Campaign - Balanced?

[bwv]

The German player in Minsk has one huge advantage over his historical counterpart, which is he knows there is a major attack coming. The German will lose alot of troops in the initial assault but with good play can avoid the large operational encirclements that destroyed AG center in 1944. The point of Minsk as the Germans is to delay and survive and the VPs are scored accordingly. The numerous rivers and swamps create choke points for the Soviets and can be defended.

[cazart!]

the germans are doomed.

They were doomed on June 22, 1941....

[Nitram Draw]

I have checked Sgt Fury's campaign and though it seems to be more playable than the stock I still think that with a moderate russian play the germans are doomed.

force ratio :
-460.000 vs. 250.000 men -> and a significant part of the soviet army consists of guards units

-12.000 vs. 3.000 guns -> if the germans try to make a stand somewhere they will be vaporized in a few turns by the heavy artillery

-6.000 vs. 1.500 vehicles

-2.400 vs. 223 planes...... -> this combined with the 25% air availability and the meagre 15% Axis Air Interception results in a deadly mix..

And not to forget that the Germans will loose considerable amount of units during first turns of the soviet breakthrough.

I havent played a single minute with the campaign but by just looking at the numbers and the starting situation I cannot see any possible way for the german player to avoid certain defeat.

So if I were you Marquo I would choose another title to play.

The Germans are definately going to get hammered in any version. The question is does it translate into enought VP's for a win? You need to capture a lot of grouond as the Russians and the vast majority of you units are slow.
I liked Sgt Fury the best as the additional units can help the Germans conduct a more orderly retreat. It may not be historically accurate but it's more fun for the German than the stock campaign, which is an exercise in continuous retreat! :)

[Sch]

bmw and Nitram Draw :

I can see your point but 149 turns is an awful lot of time. I have the impressions that with all the mobile formations the russians have they can eliminate 90% of the german units within this timeframe.

I mostly play the campaigns of pzc titles. I have had around 20 bigger games so far, none of which was decided by the actual vp score.

If someone had to give up it was always because that he lost so many units that it was pointless to go on.

Anyway I havent played the map so I might be wrong.


cazart! :

I completely disagree with you.
Die Deutsche Wehrmacht was simply the best military formation of its era.

Had Hitler not interfered with military affairs and left the actual decision making to his staff, Europe would be speaking German now.

But this is kind stuff is offtopic.

[Nitram Draw]

bmw and Nitram Draw :

I can see your point but 149 turns is an awful lot of time. I have the impressions that with all the mobile formations the russians have they can eliminate 90% of the german units within this timeframe.

It's a big map and while there are a fair amount of moblie Russian formations they can't be everywhere. While the Germans may be in instant retreat mode, some units will be pretty intact during the retreat and can put up a good delaying action. Depending on which bridges blow and how orderly the German retreat it's not always a cakewalk. Also Sgt Fury adds a 1/2 dozen or so armour divisions to the Germans and they can more than blunt a small Russian mobile spearhead on their front. That's one reason I like his mod. The Germans can actually mount a decent counter attack occasionally.

[Mike Bowen]

I got a minor as the Germans but it was close

What I did was 1 attack out of the lines if you breakthrough that will divert a lot of Russians then use those units to block possible supply source

2 Rail every one back I could

3 Blow rails wherever it would be a pain

4 Dig in like mad

5 Form the Pz you get into a large force and hit the hopefully out of ammo fuel Russians when they are tired and over extended

6 Hide and then pop out and try and grab VP hexes behind the line

7 Do not give up hope

Mike