Sniper vs Armoured vehicle.

[Imp]

You wont find it happen that often chance for a succesful assault on a tank is based on a number of factors. Off the top of my head.
The normals
So Move status terrain suppresion.
A suppresed or damaged target increases chance of success hugely vs vehicles, suppresion equals buttoned cant see squat.
The other big factor in assualts is number of men the more the better.
Lone man might make it undetected, 10 trying even if the tank spots 2-3 some will likely get to it. Several early russian tanks about the anything bow mounted MGs were any use for was spraying the tank in front to stop assaults.
If your playing a campaign with high experience units this will effect the outcome game engine begins to break down when units get much over 100 experience they become to good but using standard units even scoring an immobilise kill with a sniper is very rare vs closed top vehicle. Open top a grenade or shoot the driver followed by a crash would do it.

[wulfir]

Several early russian tanks about the anything bow mounted MGs were any use for was spraying the tank in front to stop assaults.

True. Even the bow MG of such a fantastic piece as the T-34 was barley useful as the operator could hardly see anything, especially not if the tank was moving.

I can not remember seeing snipers or bailed out crewmen cause much damage to armoured vehicles in spww2/mbt, but I have seen it a number of times when playing variants of Spwaw.

[roman]

I think the point is to see if it can be true that one man is capable of killing a tank. I apologize to those with combat experience, but I give my opinion.
I think that in certain circumstances it may be feasible, especially if the tank is not accompanied by infantry. Other factors may be:
1) the speed of the tank: If the tank is slowly moved a man can reach it from behind.
2) the ground: in cities and woodlands lone tank you could be easy prey.
3) The characteristics of the tank: Where is the engine tank, as it opens its hatch.
Again I speak from a hypothesis. Sorry if I'm wrong, it's just ignorance.

[Gila]

You wont find it happen that often chance for a succesful assault on a tank is based on a number of factors. Off the top of my head.
The normals
So Move status terrain suppresion.
A suppresed or damaged target increases chance of success hugely vs vehicles, suppresion equals buttoned cant see squat.
The other big factor in assualts is number of men the more the better.
Lone man might make it undetected, 10 trying even if the tank spots 2-3 some will likely get to it. Several early russian tanks about the anything bow mounted MGs were any use for was spraying the tank in front to stop assaults.
If your playing a campaign with high experience units this will effect the outcome game engine begins to break down when units get much over 100 experience they become to good but using standard units even scoring an immobilise kill with a sniper is very rare vs closed top vehicle. Open top a grenade or shoot the driver followed by a crash would do it.

So what's your stance on this it's kinda hard to gather from your reply as you are all over there:).
I played a short campaign as US not long ago, small core, coy of infrantry 3 greyhounds and a section of scouts and 2 snipers.
5 battles in each the germans had 6-7 tanks mostly panthers assaulted them all and either immobolized them or KO"d them outright several times by grunts scouts or a single sniper,none had bazookas just grenades finished the lame ones with the greyhounds after they were too suppressed.
Try it sometime you'd be amazed(;

[spwaw]

Just few words.

Fix this with small update ,pls.

[Cross]

Just few words.

Fix this with small update ,pls.

None of us are game developers on this site.

You would have to go to the Shrapnel site (linked earlier) and ask them there.

[spwaw]

And now you tell that to me.....
My snipers remember that on next battle whats not updated :)

I try them now, if i dont come back then you know what happened.

[GUNSLNGR]

I remember reading, and forgive me I can't remember the source (hopefully not a movie) - that the Germans didn't have a very effective infantry carried anti-tank weapon early in the war and that infantry soldiers were taught various means of disabling armored vehicles. Grenades in exhausts, transmissions, engines, etc.

I've also heard, though I don't know for sure, that tank hatches didn't latch from the inside so that crews could escape easily in event the inside became uninhabitable - though I'd imagine after a few were killed by grenades being thrown in, they'd of figured something out.

Also, it's not covered in the game that I know of, but what is the armor of the very underbelly of a tank. I'd imagine it would be extremely thin there to save overall weight and that it would never be exposed...until some sharp sniper threw a grenade under there.

As far as the game goes - a lone, unsuppressed sniper would be near invisible to a buttoned tank. If he was trained and knew exactly where to take out an enemy tank - then, as far as the game goes, it is extremely feasible. Was it IRL? I'd think it would be provided that a number of factors added up for the sniper -

1) the tank was moving slow enough that he could put the grenade where it needed to be.

2) nobody in the tank or nearby saw him approach

3) he got the grenade right where it needed to be (and he knew where that was, for that particular tank)

As far a distance goes...remember the hexes represent 50 meters, but it doesn't mean that units in adjacent hexes are 50 to 100 meters apart only. It can also mean they are just feet apart (unit 1 is in far right of its hex and unit 2 is in far let of its hex, for example). The game just doesn't allow for adjustments below the 50 meter hex size - nor, as it is, could it.

I'd further hypothesize (sp?) that early war tanks would be far easier for regular infantry men to take out in a close assault than those produced later in the war - as the tankers would have figured out ways to prevent those type of attacks (like a grate over the exhaust, so grenade can't get in).

I don't recall ever taking out a tank with a sniper or typically armed infantry (no AT weapons) - but I've killed lots of armored vehicles and SP guns with close assaults. Realistic? I think it would have been.

[Cross]

IAs far a distance goes...remember the hexes represent 50 meters, but it doesn't mean that units in adjacent hexes are 50 to 100 meters apart only. It can also mean they are just feet apart (unit 1 is in far right of its hex and unit 2 is in far let of its hex, for example). The game just doesn't allow for adjustments below the 50 meter hex size - nor, as it is, could it.

Hi Gunslngr,

One way the game could adjust for below 50M range is to only allow 'close assaults' when in the same hex as the target, instead of the current adjacent (1 hex) range.

Remember in the old days when you could load infantry into a truck in an adjacent hex? Then it was sensibly changed to the same hex.

I wonder if the same thing should be done with 'close assaults'?

You would still be able to throw grenades at AFVs 1 hex away, but you'd only get the 'close assault' bonus when in the same hex.

I would think that would be a step towards greater realism.

[oldrocky]

It happens rarely but it is possible. Imagine the sniper shoots the vehicle commander and the driver, now without visual guidance from the CO, drives into a ditch or obstacle and rolls/smashes the vehicles.

s**t happens.