KwK 40 L/48 vs StuK 40 L/48?

[Crossroads]

And the same units in winter camo:





:looks good:

[Crossroads]

In scenario editor:



Regarding the StuG hard values, it seems it is not possible to add a Commader unit type that can fire as well. That avenue to add a bit of fire power to Stu Bn - without changes to unit values as such - is not available then.

The remaining option is to create a completely new Stu platoon unit, and to provide it with new values. Here's what I've got in my mind at the moment:

T-34/85
P05021 28 24 20 16 14 10 6

PzKpfw IV H/J
P05125 28 26 24 22 19 16 13 12 11 10 9 8

New Stu-40:
P05127 28 24 22 20 17 12 9 6

Stu-40 as-is
P05008 24 22 20 18 15 12 9 6

Motivation: at point-blanc range the StuK has the same value as KwK, there after for the next 1000 meters it is KwK minus two points.

For my Lapland Mod scenarios, the Stu-40 is the only modern AFV type to oppose the T-34/43s and /85s, not to mention IS-2s. So it needs to be able to hold up a tad better.

This seems like a good compromise, given the reason StuGs are undergunned in comparison to Pz IVs with the same main gun and ammonition is the optics, as Mike observed earlier in this thread.

Your thoughts?

[Huib Versloot]

Same guns + ammo should have same values, it is as simple as that. The old Talonsoft guys made several mistakes and overcomplications that cannot be explained. If you take into account how littered with errors the original game is (ask Jason) , it is a miracle it has been so playable all these years. However the Stug has been a problem in designing. I tried to compensate by adding high(est) morale + level 5 leader occasionally.

Huib

[Crossroads]

Thanks Huib, I am a bit hesitant to change original values but what you say makes sense. I will test with similar values until 1500 range, given the more available AP40 round.

That, and availability of leaders should even the things up nicely.

[Huib Versloot]

Thanks Huib, I am a bit hesitant to change original values but what you say makes sense. I will test with similar values until 1500 range, given the more available AP40 round.

That, and availability of leaders should even the things up nicely.

If I were you I would create a new unit for the StuG with the values that you think will represent the Finnish situation. You can alway change or tweak them should that be necessary. I would see it as an opportunity to make an improvement. (Be sure to test without armor facing on)

[Crossroads]

Cheers Huib,

Yes, I always create completely new units instead of changing existing ones.

I am now testing the gradually improved units with AF on and AF off.

Testing so far would support the idea of upgrading the StuGs up til 1500 meters (6 hexes) with identical hard values compared to Pz IV H.

They'd still not be supernatural, but at least they could then fire one volley vs IS-2s and T-34s expecting to achieve something.

The new armoured leaders help too. I opted to have a lvl 4 battalion commander and lvl 3 company commanders, giving each StuG pack (Coy) a leader to improve things as well.

Did you see Mike's bitmaps from the other thread:


Über kool, I would say