Help with Smolensk Operational Situation 6

[GerryM]

Hello All:

I lost this as the Jerries. It is an infantry meeting engagement and the Germans start near the supply icon. I quickly controlled the nearby 100-point VL. But I could never move beyond that. As you can see in the graphic, I never got beyond that. It became a slugfest with neither side making much progress.

I cannot see how the Germans can take any on the other victory locations? Any big picture or other ideas much appreciated.

Note that neither side has armor and only the Russians have artillery. The Germans do have air support.


  Smolensk Operational Situation 6.jpg (Size: 167.4 KB / Downloads: 58)

Gerry

[Liebchen]

I'm not really familiar with the scenario, but will say that the things that the Germans have going for them are:

a. Mobility
b. Larger units
c. Better morale

I see two roads going out to each flank and swinging around to the Russian rear-area objectives. You could send some mobile units that way to keep the Russians honest.

Looking closer, though, I see that your infantry does not appear to be motorized. What's under the Objective marker? Is any of it mobile? Perhaps it should have been sent around the flanks....

It doesn't appear that you're using Fog of War. Knowing where the Russians are should make it even easier to take advantage of the flanking move, since it'll let you see the effects that you're having on their deployment.

[GerryM]

Hello:

I am using FOW; that screen I attached is the end screen.

I have one mobile unit. It says it's a Recon Bn. It is Infantry loaded in trucks I think (415 men). I should have swung this out wide for a flanking maneuver but made the mistake of having it caught in the town with the 100-point objective.

My units have Morale B.

My 35th Panzerjaeger Bn ( 31 x 37mm AT Guns) started on the West side of the map also and I moved them to the 100-point location. Was that the correct place for them? I thought they would be good in terms of defending but cannot really be used on the offensive.

Thanks for you help,

Gerry

[burroughs]

The discussion here inspired me enough to run that and my opinion is that there was nothing wrong with the result You achieved - mine was the same, under 100 points, giving the OKW a minor defeat. After the scenario got concluded, debriefing revealed that the German division faces two Soviet infantry ones, one of them of the same "B" quality that advances NW and finally occupies a higher ground before the last leg of their trip - the assault on the town. Jerries have no arty and no air support, the force ratio is at least 1:2 to their disadvantage. There is only one highly mobile unit - the recon battalion - serving as the maneuver element, but it gets easily blocked whether they're sent NE or down SE to try to flank the main axis of both forces advance route - the other Soviet division either blocks successfully one of the ways or advances in a pincer movement on both flanks as it was in my encounter. If the Germans are to assault farther east towards remaining victory locations, they meet the Soviet mainforce "B" quality division occupying the ridge east of the already German held town. The Soviet direct fire supported by arty fire missions causes significant losses and both forces stall unable to break on another - I am affraid the competent Soviet human commander would achieve even more devastating results. It's the WWI 1914 typical situation after the end of the maneuver phase - two mainly infantry type operational elements holding one another in check and unable to break the deadlock. No worries.

[GerryM]

Hello:

I am trying it again and doing much better. I sent the Recon Bn off on 1 flank as Liebchen suggested. They ran into a Soviet unit, backed off, and I tried a slightly different route after the visibility dropped. They successfully got into the enemy's rear.

I am most happy about the improvement around the 100-point town objective. This time I kept my troops mostly in Village/Town hexes. The enemy is then attacking from Clear hexes. This has made a huge difference.

You are correct in that the Soviets have an awful lot of troops.

Gerry

[burroughs]

Just remember that any second or following consecutive run is not informative anymore - the fog of war has been spoilt irreversibly and at best it is yet one more rehearshal, but it's not a show a genuine wargamer is after, but a simulation. There is a guy here, I think his codename is Case Blue or something - that guy seems to be playing over and over the same Smolensk '41 scenarios, he pops up here on the forums once in a while, looking for opponents. I would never consider accepting that challenge - I don't mind fighting a much better fellow wargamer, I have been doing that numerous times, but against a guy who has seen that all before: been there, done that, bought the T-shirt ... or the farm. Nevermind, doing the same thing over and over gets You the knowledge about the mechanics of the game engine, but the real challenge is fighting a gainst a human opponent a scenario neither side has done before.

After the battle I also came to the conclusion that it would be much better to send the motorized recon up the northern flank ... Besides, the AI is dumb in the long run: first it successflully blocked me, I withdrew, but after the conclusion I saw that the very same battalions were finally stacked all together and gave way which I didn't know since I am used to human opponents who, after getting to know I am trying to outflank them and ppreventing me once from doing so, would secure their flanks much better. The Soviet AI once they lost me from sight, were indulging themselves in an outrageous inactivity whereas I was arongly thinking there's no chance to penetrate the southern flank anymore, the element of suprise was lost irretrievably and hacking the way through was out of the question.

[GerryM]

I'm not really familiar with the scenario, but will say that the things that the Germans have going for them are:

a. Mobility
b. Larger units
c. Better morale

Hello:

Can someone explain how the above German advantages should be used in the proper way, especially the Morale one.

Does this mean that the Germans should try and slug it out with the Soviets. Or does it mean they would be better in Assaults than the Soviets?

I know that every little difference matters. I am just trying to learn how to use some of these differences. (I imagine the Mobility advantage allows them to do flanking moves.)

Thanks,

Gerry

[Dog Soldier]

I think the point of the 'tutorial' scenario Smolensk Operational Situation 6 is to demonstrate the that the German infantry divisions are vulnerable even though they begin with level of 'B' quality when operating on their own.

The example in this scenario is a single German infantry division against two Soviet. One of the Soviet divisions is one of the best and equal to the German division.

Expecting the German division to prevail unaided is a bit optimistic. Play it from the Russian side. The German division will be in trouble, especially if commanded by the AI.

Dog Soldier

[Liebchen]

I'm not really familiar with the scenario, but will say that the things that the Germans have going for them are:

a. Mobility
b. Larger units
c. Better morale

Hello:

Can someone explain how the above German advantages should be used in the proper way, especially the Morale one.

Does this mean that the Germans should try and slug it out with the Soviets. Or does it mean they would be better in Assaults than the Soviets?

I know that every little difference matters. I am just trying to learn how to use some of these differences. (I imagine the Mobility advantage allows them to do flanking moves.)

Thanks,

Gerry

Germans can/should slug it out with Soviets where the stakes warrant it. They should always choose their battles, when that's possible.

Better morale means better fire combat as well as better assault odds. But assaults often cause lots of fatigue, whereas shooting only brings fatigue resulting from the (often less effective) Russian defensive fire. So whittle away at the Soviets with your B class units' fire, disrupt as many as you can (because disrupted Soviets can't assault), and then assault disrupted Soviet units that are actually in your way (or are surrounded and liable to surrender en masse).

The larger formations are handy for two things: You can break up a battalion and spread the companies out to hold the flanks, or you can concentrate them into 700-900 man units, very powerful.

German mobility should be used to keep the Soviets guarding their flanks, as you've already discovered.

Final note: One you've mastered the BASIC mechanics, I REALLY recommend that you play humans. As Burroughs pointed out, the AI tends to do some really stupid things and you will either get a false sense of achievement or will get bored/frustrated by the lack of challenge.

[Liebchen]

German mobility should be used to keep the Soviets guarding their flanks, as you've already discovered.

... and for exploitation when the opportunity arises, of course.