The Competition & Teaser Thread

[Strela]

Hello David:

What do you mean by:
"Game map at zoom level 2 with units (42mb JPG file)"

There are 18 large scale maps. How this this relate to the quote above? Is the quoted item another planning map for each scenario?

Thanks,

Gerry

Hi Gerry,

The Game Map at zoom level 2 uses the actual game graphics to give you the equivalent of a massive 100K hex map. Just head down to Kinko's! The map with units has Nato symbols as shown below, the without is a clear map with labels.

As a reminder you can see what Zoom level 2 looks like in relation to the other zoom levels in the following picture;





Yes, the other quoted item is a planning map per day. See (a section of) a planning map in my next post.

David

[Strela]

It's time to put ComradeP & Kuriltai out of their misery!!

It's also a good chance to give you an overview of some scenarios from the game and how they are built around a day.

You both finally narrowed it down to the July 8th counterattacks by Voronezh Front. There was actually as many Soviet tanks involved here as at Prokhorovka four days later. Both Das Reich & Leibstandarte's Panzergruppe had attacked to the North West (hence the out of bounds area) to try and get XXXXVIII Panzer Korp moving again. The SS were left with a fairly thin screen to face two full and two partial Tank Corps with a few Guards Rifle Regiments thrown in.


Here is the appropriate segment from Mike Avanzini's planning maps. This is only the actual battle area - Mikes map has the whole front for the whole day laid out in this format.

The scenario you had seen the game map for previously is marked as the largest green box - #0708_01 here. All the smaller scenarios are marked accordingly;







With that in mind here are the descriptions for the various scenarios shown on this particular map. There are nine in total of which three are tweaked vs. the AI variants. The AI variants have an 'a' suffix.


#0708_01 Voronezh Front - July 8: While the Cats Away... Turns : 23
Teterevino South, South West of Prokhorovka: July 8th, 1943. (Scenario Size: Army. Head to Head or Team Play, Soviet Human vs German AI) General Oberst Hermann Hoth was frustrated. The II SS Panzerkorps had penetrated beyond the second Soviet defensive line, but neither the III nor XXXXVIII Panzerkorps had kept pace. To make matters worse, nowhere had the Soviets been decisively destroyed, enemy units had been pushed back and displaced but rarely had formations been surrounded and decimated. Hoth ordered both Leibstandarte and Das Reich to detach their Panzergruppes and attack North West to assist XXXXVIII Panzerkorps advance and hopefully trap a significant portion of General Lieutenant Mikhail Katukov's 1st Tank Army. Unbeknownst to the Germans, Voronezh Front's commander, General Nikolai Fyodorovich Vatutin was trying to manoeuvre four Tank Corps to attack II SS Panzerkorps extended right flank and push through the German lines trapping the SS in his own encirclement. Fortune smiled upon the Soviets as they prepared the 600 tanks of 2nd, 2nd Guards, 5th Guards and 10th Tank Corps to attack the extended 25 kilometre long right flank of the II SS Panzerkorps that would be bereft of its own armour. The biggest challenge for the Soviet tankers was the less than eight hours that they were given to prepare Vatutin's first big counter thrust.



#0708_02 Teterevino North - Franz's Excellent Adventure. Turns : 8
Teterevino North, South West of Prokhorovka: July 8th, 1943. (Scenario Size: Battalion. Either Side vs AI or Head to Head) SS-Unterscharführer Franz Staudegger and SS-Sturmmann Rolf Schamp's Tigers had not joined the rest of Leibstandarte's Panzer Regiment due to track and chassis damage. The two vehicles were mobile, but only just and had been left behind in Teterevino North with a company from Das Reich to expedite repairs. Colonel Grigory Yakovlevich Andriushchenko's 183rd Tank Brigade was in the vanguard of 10th Tank Corp's push to hit the SS 'on the nose'. Vatutin was trying to coordinate four Tank Corps to hit the extended German Eastern flank. 10th Tank Corps was the northernmost armored formation and was the first into action. Unfortunately 183rd Tank Brigade arrived piecemeal which allowed the Tigers and supporting troops to handle the Soviet Brigade without being completely overwhelmed. Staudegger's command was so successful that he was awarded the Knights Cross for the twenty two tanks his Tiger destroyed in the engagement. Coupled with the other Russian tanks lost to both Schamp and the Panzer Grenadiers, 183rd Tank Brigade lost half its vehicle in this one engagement.



#0708_03 Kalinin - The Northern Attack. Turns : 22
#0708_03a Kalinin - The Northern Attack. Turns : 22
Kalinin, South West of Prokhorovka: July 8th, 1943. (Scenario Size: Corps. Head to Head or Team Play) Major General Andrei Grigorevich Kravchenko's 5th Guards Tank Corps was to go back into action less than 12 hours after having to free its forces from encirclement. The order to retake the area around Kalinin and Ozerovskii was only received at 2am and stipulated that the attack was to commence no later than 10am. Once these two villages were taken, the Guards were to continue pushing west to Luchki North and cut the highway and block the German supplies required further to the north. Kravchenko was assured that both 2nd Guards to the south and the arriving 2nd Tank Corps to the north would be ready to commence operations in tandem with his own forces. The late arrival of 2nd Tank Corps was to leave Kravchenko sorely disappointed. This version of the scenario includes the available forces from 2nd & 10th Tank Corps as well as 5th Guards. 2nd Tank Corps will begin their advance from 2pm.



#0708_04 Kalinin Small - Kravchenko's Riposte. Turns : 15
#0708_04a Kalinin Small - Kravchenko's Riposte. Turns : 15
Kalinin, South West of Prokhorovka: July 8th, 1943. (Scenario Size: Corps. Head to Head) Major General Andrei Grigorevich Kravchenko's 5th Guards Tank Corps was to go back into action less than 12 hours after having to free its forces from encirclement. The order to retake the area around Kalinin and Ozerovskii was only received at 2am and stipulated that the attack was to commence no later than 10am. Once these two villages were taken, the Guards were to continue pushing west to Luchki North and cut the highway and block the German supplies required further to the north. Kravchenko was assured that both 2nd Guards to the south and the arriving 2nd Tank Corps to the north would be ready to commence operations in tandem with his own forces. The late arrival of 2nd Tank Corps was to leave Kravchenko sorely disappointed. This version of the scenario is smaller and only includes the available forces from 5th Guards Tank Corps.



#0708_05 Teterevino South - Human Wave. Turns : 15
Teterevino South, South of Prokhorovka: July 8th, 1943. (Scenario Size: Regiment. Soviet Human vs German AI) Major Mikhail Konstantinovich Belov had been given very clear orders. His 158th Guards Rifle Regiment had regrouped at Tetrevino South and was to attack Luchki South from the East. Voronezh Front intended this to be a diversionary attack, hopefully pinning or dragging away reserves from other parts of the German line. The assault would not be easy. The Guardsmen had to cross a deep, kilometre wide valley before assaulting the defenders on Hill 210.7. After breaking through they were to move towards the town and capture the bridge crossing the Donets and clear the town of any remaining enemy. Voronezh Front had provided both air and artillery support in the hope that the attack would be considered a major thrust rather than the intended demonstration. Russian players note - Don't forget to use smoke when crossing exposed areas.



#0708_06 Gostishchevo - 2nd Guards Tank Corps Attacks. Turns : 22
#0708_06a Gostishchevo - 2nd Guards Tank Corps Attacks. Turns : 22
Gostishchevo, South of Prokhorovka: July 8th, 1943. (Scenario Size: Corps. Head to Head) The 167th Infanterie Division was late. The 315th & 331st Infanterie Regiments were due to relieve Totenkopf at first light taking over its defensive sector. Totenkopf was expected to lead the renewed SS attack towards Prokhorovka the following day. For Major General Aleksei Semenovich Burdeiny, the attack of his 2nd Guards Tank Corps might unknowingly fall on the Germans at a time of greatest weakness - rotation of units. The delayed arrival of 167th Infantrie just avoided that risk. The attack by 2nd Guards Tank Corps was accompanied by a regiment from 89th Guards Rifle Division. The attack was initially successful with the Soviets almost reaching their ultimate goal of Genki, but the appearance of Totenkopf's Panzer Regiment ultimately resulted in the Soviets being pushed back. This engagement was also the first time that the HS-129 tank destroyer aircraft were used en-masse and they were attributed with severely disrupting two of the three attacking Guards Tank brigades.



David

[GerryM]

David:

Lovely maps, lovely history. A wonderful job. Unfortunately it seems to me that these scenarios in terms of units will be tending towards very large. I know there are 9 Battalion ones IIRC. But the map area for #0708_01, unless I am not understanding, seems huge. Of course I don't know the scale and don't know the history well enough to tell the distances between towns/villages.

The tendency towards large seems to come out of the games relationship with PzC. And I know some people are wondering how large the scenarios can be as they want that. I imagine these are players that have no problem with the number of units in a PzC campaign scenario.

Again you and your team are doing a wonderful job.

Gerry

[Strela]

David:

Lovely maps, lovely history. A wonderful job. Unfortunately it seems to me that these scenarios in terms of units will be tending towards very large. I know there are 9 Battalion ones IIRC. But the map area for #0708_01, unless I am not understanding, seems huge. Of course I don't know the scale and don't know the history well enough to tell the distances between towns/villages.

The tendency towards large seems to come out of the games relationship with PzC. And I know some people are wondering how large the scenarios can be as they want that. I imagine these are players that have no problem with the number of units in a PzC campaign scenario.

Again you and your team are doing a wonderful job.

Gerry

Gerry,

It's not as daunting as it looks. Here is #0708_02 Franz's scenario (no fog of war). Its a SS Battalion vs a Soviet Tank Brigade. You can see the unit density is pretty reasonable...!






David

[ComradeP]

Gerry, I think most of these scenarios will be small to medium sized. That does depend on what you call small, but I think the scenarios with 1 regiment could be compared to roughly a divisional size PzC scenario, and the scenario David just posted is even smaller.

The full Tank Corps+supporting units sized scenarios would presumably be about the size of a reinforced Corps attack in PzC terms.

Contrary to PzC, this game will actually have smaller scenarios that are actually small in terms of units involved. For PzC "small" often still involved a corps or Soviet army.

-

I think the visual OOB document is a really nice touch, my compliments to the person compiling it.

[Xaver]

WOAAA all this info in a little space could be mortal for us

Like Jack the ripper says "proceed by parts"

1-Obstacles/mines, ok, they work like i expect except the miss of the open status, for me as they are in PzB win a lot of value because are more than a first stop, they can be permanent block and casualty makers if you dont use your engineer units, this is a great improvement on their tactical value and remove them is a must have if you want have a clear path but i have a little question about minefields... you say they inflict casualties when an unit enter on them but... when they leave the minefield to??? how this works??? i dont remember see a wargame where when an unit leave a minefield suffer casualties

2-great know that we are going to know the winner of competition before game release but you say to winner(s) this means more than 1 or you count split personalities

3-Finally ComradeP can sleep and stop diving in books a little more and hahahaha.

4-to be on my line i have a little petition... we can see an image where is visible a victory point??? thanks.

Finally the countdown starts, i think you are going to use this week to finish the last things on game and next week to sell it with the release of info, the competition winner and i suspect the release date is going to be 28

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[Tide1]

2-great know that we are going to know the winner of competition before game release but you say to winner(s) this means more than 1 or you count split personalities TEEHEE



Xaver why do you want to see a victory point ? They all look the same nothing exciting like a Panther turning a T34 into scrap or a Stuka screaming down.

[Compass Rose]

Things are looking very, very good however, you guys are forgetting the most important documentation you could possibly release, for guys like me........

You forgot to list the "Panzer Battles for Dummies" documentation or are you still working on that?

[Strela]

Things are looking very, very good however, you guys are forgetting the most important documentation you could possibly release, for guys like me........

You forgot to list the "Panzer Battles for Dummies" documentation or are you still working on that?

It's called the 'Getting Started Guide'!!!

---

I think the visual OOB document is a really nice touch, my compliments to the person compiling it.

Mike Avanzini (Rzhev42 here on the boards) has done a wonderful job on the Visual OB's and all the planning maps. He is also our Order of Battle guru and created all the Germans and fixed all the Soviets I had done!!!

He has been a great partner for the whole project.


David

[Xaver]

Do your refer to this guide???

"kicked from PzC to PzB dummies version"



Well, i am curious about the victory point icon... if you change the depots i suspect you do the same with them... or not???

Come on Tide, if the competition winner has split personalities them recive 1 game per personality???

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