tournament proposal

[oldrocky]

This is my idea for a new tournament of which I will be willing to create and officiate if interest is shown.

This team play tournament will represent one day of battle on the Eastern Front during August of 1944. Each battle ( segment) will be 20 turns in length representing one hour of combat at which time the game will pause as the map is edited , reserves/reinforcements committed, win/loss conditions are calculated and units transferred from one map to another; then the next segment will begin right where the last segment left off. Each segment will be scored using the standard scoring system currently in use at the Blitz, after which the next segment will begin using the same map, forces and/or reserves that have been committed and/or forces that have transferred from an adjacent map. After each segment I, ( The Game Master), will make the necessary adjustments to the map and force dispositions ( KIAs, vehicle immobilized, reserves, force transfers, etc. ) according to the orders given by the opposing Commanding Generals (CGs). The initial map size and composition of the forces will be determined by the number of participants involved as well as by player preference.


Each team will represent either a German or a Soviet force and will be commanded by the Commanding General (CG). The CG is in overall command of the subordinate team players and will issue orders to the subordinates as the tactical situation dictates and demands. The CG will be the only player in possession of the Master Situational Map and therefore will he be the only one who has the entire overall picture of the battlefield so he will be the one in the best position to direct the subordinate players in their tactical conduct. The CG will be the final authority as to the direction of the overall maneuver scheme and to the subordination of the players under his command. ( I can envision a situation where a subordinate commander may not agree with an order from the CG and therefore not be willing to execute a disagreeable command. In this case the CG, as it is in the REAL tactical world, has the option of dismissing this commander and replacing him. (( Or having him shot.)) But be advised Colonels, you will command only a section of the battlefield and only the CG will have the complete and overall picture of the situation. The Master Situation Map cannot be shared with or viewed by the subordinate commanders.


As it is a team effort a win or loss will be shared by the team. A player can lose his individual battle during a segment yet still be awarded a victory for that segment depending on the overall team result for that segment.


The Game Master will create a Map that encompasses the entire Area of Operations (AO).( To which only the CGs are allowed to view in its complete entirety). This master map will then be divided into sectors; the number of sectors will be determined by the number of players involved. Each player ( a Colonel) will then be assigned a sector by his team CG and the forces he will use to accomplish his mission will also be allocated to him by the CG who will draw these forces from the supply depot which has been established and stocked before the game begins. Example: A Soviet Tank Brigade versus a German Regimental Kampfgruppe is envisioned for this example; Each with 1 to 2 Tank Battalions- comprised of approximately 50 to 70 tanks in total , an Infantry Battalion and supporting Artillery, Recon, Engineers, etc. will complete the force. The opposing forces will be roughly even in terms of purchase points, combat power and maneuverability. As it will be the CG of each team who will allocate forces to his commanders depending on the maneuver scheme he has developed then it is possible that on a given map an opponent may be outnumbered, or vice verso. It all depends on how the CGs decide to deploy their force. The CG may also decide to keep an off map reserve for later deployment or even as a fire brigade in case of emergency.


The number of total game segments is undetermined. I anticipate that after a few segments there will not be much left in the way of maneuver forces if the battles are fought as I have fought them in the past , and seen them fought at the Blitz over the years. An entirely new style of maneuver must be developed by the players ensuring force conservation if they expect to go the distance. The tournament is WON by having all available V hex's on all the competing maps captured during a segment.


Also; "ammo" will be "ON" and resupply will be limited which will also require a separate brand of conservation because as one segment ends and the next begins the surviving units will posses the exact same ammo allocation as they did when ending the previous segment. In fact everything will be the same because it is a continuation of the previous segment. The only change to the forces will be units that may enter the map between segments either as reserves or as a movement from an adjacent map during the segment break; OR you may be ordered by the CG to transfer some of your units into off map reserve; OR the CG may order you to assemble a company ( or more ) on your map edge at a certain location in anticipation of transferring that force to an adjacent map during a segment break. ( Which will require extensive editing by the Game Master after each segment. However this will be eased by the fact that I will be the one creating the initial battles therefore I will have a master roster for each map and force involved.) It is very likely that your units will need to resupply during the tournament, that is if they survive long enough, so allowances during the maneuver scheme for this eventuality must be anticipated.


This is only a preview of my Tournament Game System and there is much more to it but as you can see it expands the standard 20 to 30 turn game that most are used to playing into a battle which will now allow complex maneuver schemes to be employed. With this Game System a team could actually lose every previous battle while wearing down his OPFOR and in the end win the tournament by capturing all of the MASTER MAP V hex's in a devastating last segment. A skilled and thoughtful CG has now the time with this system to employ Feints and Ambushes. The CG could lure an unsuspecting opponent into a well planned battle of annihilation by allowing his foe to advance in the center and then in later segments envelope him in a destructive pincer movement. The maneuver options are unlimited. You get the idea.

If there is enough interest I will commence to writing up a detailed ROE and creating a suitable Battle Map.

Oldrocky

[Air Master]

This is my idea for a new tournament of which I will be willing to create and officiate if interest is shown.

This team play tournament will represent one day of battle on the Eastern Front during August of 1944. Each battle ( segment) will be 20 turns in length representing one hour of combat at which time the game will pause as the map is edited , reserves/reinforcements committed, win/loss conditions are calculated and units transferred from one map to another; then the next segment will begin right where the last segment left off. Each segment will be scored using the standard scoring system currently in use at the Blitz, after which the next segment will begin using the same map, forces and/or reserves that have been committed and/or forces that have transferred from an adjacent map. After each segment I, ( The Game Master), will make the necessary adjustments to the map and force dispositions ( KIAs, vehicle immobilized, reserves, force transfers, etc. ) according to the orders given by the opposing Commanding Generals (CGs). The initial map size and composition of the forces will be determined by the number of participants involved as well as by player preference.
Each team will represent either a German or a Soviet force and will be commanded by the Commanding General (CG). The CG is in overall command of the subordinate team players and will issue orders to the subordinates as the tactical situation dictates and demands. The CG will be the only player in possession of the Master Situational Map and therefore will he be the only one who has the entire overall picture of the battlefield so he will be the one in the best position to direct the subordinate players in their tactical conduct. The CG will be the final authority as to the direction of the overall maneuver scheme and to the subordination of the players under his command. ( I can envision a situation where a subordinate commander may not agree with an order from the CG and therefore not be willing to execute a disagreeable command. In this case the CG, as it is in the REAL tactical world, has the option of dismissing this commander and replacing him. (( Or having him shot.)) But be advised Colonels, you will command only a section of the battlefield and only the CG will have the complete and overall picture of the situation. The Master Situation Map cannot be shared with or viewed by the subordinate commanders.
As it is a team effort a win or loss will be shared by the team. A player can lose his individual battle during a segment yet still be awarded a victory for that segment depending on the overall team result for that segment.
The Game Master will create a Map that encompasses the entire Area of Operations (AO).( To which only the CGs are allowed to view in its complete entirety). This master map will then be divided into sectors; the number of sectors will be determined by the number of players involved. Each player ( a Colonel) will then be assigned a sector by his team CG and the forces he will use to accomplish his mission will also be allocated to him by the CG who will draw these forces from the supply depot which has been established and stocked before the game begins. Example: A Soviet Tank Brigade versus a German Regimental Kampfgruppe is envisioned for this example; Each with 1 to 2 Tank Battalions- comprised of approximately 50 to 70 tanks in total , an Infantry Battalion and supporting Artillery, Recon, Engineers, etc. will complete the force. The opposing forces will be roughly even in terms of purchase points, combat power and maneuverability. As it will be the CG of each team who will allocate forces to his commanders depending on the maneuver scheme he has developed then it is possible that on a given map an opponent may be outnumbered, or vice verso. It all depends on how the CGs decide to deploy their force. The CG may also decide to keep an off map reserve for later deployment or even as a fire brigade in case of emergency.
The number of total game segments is undetermined. I anticipate that after a few segments there will not be much left in the way of maneuver forces if the battles are fought as I have fought them in the past , and seen them fought at the Blitz over the years. An entirely new style of maneuver must be developed by the players ensuring force conservation if they expect to go the distance. The tournament is WON by having all available V hex's on all the competing maps captured during a segment.
Also; "ammo" will be "ON" and resupply will be limited which will also require a separate brand of conservation because as one segment ends and the next begins the surviving units will posses the exact same ammo allocation as they did when ending the previous segment. In fact everything will be the same because it is a continuation of the previous segment. The only change to the forces will be units that may enter the map between segments either as reserves or as a movement from an adjacent map during the segment break; OR you may be ordered by the CG to transfer some of your units into off map reserve; OR the CG may order you to assemble a company ( or more ) on your map edge at a certain location in anticipation of transferring that force to an adjacent map during a segment break. ( Which will require extensive editing by the Game Master after each segment. However this will be eased by the fact that I will be the one creating the initial battles therefore I will have a master roster for each map and force involved.) It is very likely that your units will need to resupply during the tournament, that is if they survive long enough, so allowances during the maneuver scheme for this eventuality must be anticipated.
This is only a preview of my Tournament Game System and there is much more to it but as you can see it expands the standard 20 to 30 turn game that most are used to playing into a battle which will now allow complex maneuver schemes to be employed. With this Game System a team could actually lose every previous battle while wearing down his OPFOR and in the end win the tournament by capturing all of the MASTER MAP V hex's in a devastating last segment. A skilled and thoughtful CG has now the time with this system to employ Feints and Ambushes. The CG could lure an unsuspecting opponent into a well planned battle of annihilation by allowing his foe to advance in the center and then in later segments envelope him in a destructive pincer movement. The maneuver options are unlimited. You get the idea.

If there is enough interest I will commence to writing up a detailed ROE and creating a suitable Battle Map.

Oldrocky

I am in. Any tournament.

[KAreil]

Interesting idea!

What would be the size of force per player?

Which turn rate is expected?

[oldrocky]

The size of a particular force on a given map will be determined by the CG. On one map may be deployed a large force for an advance mission while on another map a smaller force may be allocated for a defense or screening mission. It depends on the maneuver scheme chosen by the CG. That is why it will be a TEAM effort and victory/defeats per segment will be determined by the OVERALL team result of a given segment. It's possible that on one map a player is only allocated a company or two for a defense mission where as the opposing CG has decided that this will be the map on which he makes his main effort thus will the defender be outnumbered. That is why victory's and defeats per each game segment will be calculated as to the overall success of the ENTIRE team for that segment. The defender in the above mentioned example may lose that individual defense battle but still gain a victory for that segment if overall his TEAM wins that segment by capturing more V hex's than his opponent on ALL the maps combined.

NOTE: the placement of V HEX"S in each segment will be determined by a couple of factors including force size ratios and the orders that are issued to the subordinate commanders by the respective CG.
EXAMPLE: On map (A) a commander is issued 2 INF Cos with orders to defend an important town/crossroads hex and also to screen North and South of the town and report/block in that area any enemy movements. The opposing commander however has been given an entire Battalion sized combined arms task force with orders to seize the cross road and exploit in the direction of the CGs choosing. In that case I will place V hex's in places that will reflect the orders of both sides and also the force ratios of each commander. If a defender is greatly outnumbered then the V hex's will be placed further away from the attacker but still within attainable range for a 20 turn segment. You won't know what you're up against until the battle starts and you've had a chance to recon/observe, and what you discover during the battle you report back to the CG so he can make overall adjustments to the Grand Maneuver Scheme: dispatch reserves to the threatened sector possibly or even allow his opponent to advance on that particular map in hopes of enveloping him from the north and south. It's all up to the CG who is in overall command and that is why it will be a team effort and a win/loss for each segment will be determined by the overall success of the team during that 20 turn segment
ALSO: The CG must command the battle using his Grand Master Map only! It is not permitted that subordinates send him files of his ongoing game or screen shots of his deployment, etc. The CG must control the Battle by reacting to the reports from his subordinate commanders only.

[oldrocky]

Be aware that as the segments progress any losses incurred during the separate battle/segments can't be replaced. The CGs will start this tournament with a set force that can't be added to.
Example: A Soviet Tank Brigade- 65xT-34/85, 1xMotorized Infantry Battalion,1xHvy Arty Battery, etc.
If during segment #1 the Soviets lose 30 tanks then at segment #2 the Soviet CG has now only 35xT-34/85s to complete the tournament with.

The initial force size has yet to be determined. This will be dependent on the numbers of players involved and also on the preference of the CGs and players on how large of a force they want. It could even end up being a German Panzer Division facing a Soviet Tank Corp on a 80 square kilometer
Master Map. It's up to you guys.

[low_bidder]

IIRC, DD did a similar tourney a decade or so ago. He should be still around, somewhere. Finding him might prevent re-inventing the wheel
I can do maps if you want help. Polish plains?. The new map editor should make it easier to overlap maps, which will be necessary in conveyer belt battles.

[oldrocky]

By august of 44 the Russians were nearly to Warsaw, Poland and the terrain in those parts are represented by several maps available in my Map Folder. I had planned on doing what you suggest and combining different maps using the map editor to create a new and unique 200x160 Area of Operations (AO). A map that large would require a sizable maneuver force up to division strength but the map could be altered/adjusted to accommodate any size force.

I hope that there is sufficient interest shown in this game concept because for a long time I have wanted to be able to replicate a WW2 action as realistically as possible. A CG in communication with his subordinates via email only would closely replicate the communication system of WW2 as long as the messages weren't too wordy. As the CG I believe it would be a gratifying challenge to maneuver/control your separate commands using a map and reports from your commanders as it was done in actuality during the war.

The ability to transfer units from one map to another so as to conduct surprise flanking maneuvers adds a new dimension to the game and is also something I look forward to seeing. This concept would also require teamwork to ensure victory; and a new style of game play. You would need to conserve your force and not take excessive/unnecessary casualties, conserve ammo, and most important: maneuver your forces by keeping companies together because the CG will be giving orders, for example: "A Tank Company must be detached from (X) battalion and proceed to the map edge at coordinate (xx,yy) and prepare for a transfer to an adjoining map at the segment break to support a neighboring operation." This would be quite difficult to accomplished if the Company in question was scattered across the AO. The Companies must be kept in fairly close formation for another reason also and that is because the CG will need to know the locations of his units so they can be represented accurately on his Master Battle Map.
(All armed forces in any nation are taught to maneuver their tactical elements in formation and not spread them helter skelter across the (AO).) The system the CG uses to keep track and Identify his forces on the Battle Map is up to him.

[oldrocky]

Lowbidder wrote:

I can do maps if you want help. Polish plains?. The new map editor should make it easier to overlap maps, which will be necessary in conveyer belt battles.

These will not be conveyor belt battles but rather One Battle on One Map divided into segments. Each 20 turn segment represents one hour in an ongoing battle taking place on one single day in August 1944.

The forces you have on map when a segment ends will be the same exact forces you have on the map when the next segment begins. If you lost ten tanks in the previous segment then you will have ten less tanks in the next segment. The units will be in the exact same place on the exact same map that they were when the previous segment ended. It is one long battle, the same battle, only broken up into segments. The units in the new segment will be exactly as they were in the last segment including losses, damage, morale, experience, etc.This will be easier to accomplish than it sounds because I will be creating the initial first battle for all maps so I will have a master map with the exact same units on it that the players have during the game segment. When a segment ends all I need to do is edit the existing units to reflect the new conditions for the next segment.

[Walrus]

Hi Old Rocky

Very interesting idea for a Tourney.
You can count me in as a non CG player for any side you choose.

Can I suggest a couple of things?

First - paragraphs!
Your opening post is just a wall of text.
Some of our guys for whom English is not their first language will have an easier time reading, and most importantly, understanding these complex ideas for your tourney if you break it up a bit more, or a lot, than you have done in this thread.
Just a though

Second - As we all play SP differently, and like / dislike different aspects of the mechanics of the game (the use of z-fire being a classic) I would suggest that a general ROE type rule set be created by you early enough that everyone gets a chance to get to grips with it before a battle is joined.

At least there will be no issues with force buying / composition, as you and the CG's will sort that out - but what is acceptable play on the map can be a TM's (that's you) nightmare. Everyone always thinks their preferred set of rules is the best, as that's what they are most comfortable with. Making an acceptable rule set, that is not too confusing or hard to police, will be crucial to keep the rules lawyering to a minimum.

I would also consider trying the do this not using Flags.
They give away the objectives so quickly (as soon as you open the map) and with the way that you will be controlling this game, knowing what the CGs have ordered and what units started the battle and what was there at the end, you should be able to make a call at the end of each game as to which commander has more successfully completed their assigned mission.

Again, that's just a thought, but I have played many excellent 'no flag' battles over the years and IMO they are always much more satisfying than ones with arbitrary flags.
Deciding the result is the tricky part of course.

I'd be happy to PM about how to successfully deal with no-flag games in general if it is of interest.

Thanks for getting a new concept up and running.
Kudos to you.
Now you just have to bring it on home....it'll be a very long tourney.

Cheers

[oldrocky]

When I wrote the article it had paragraphs which were lost during the copy and paste. I'll try to make the edit again.

I have indeed considered the "no flag" option, and also the "Flags" coupled with alternate hidden objectives assigned by the CG too. I have opted for the option that uses the FLAG because all objectives should be obvious military objectives anyway: crossroads, hills, bridges towns, etc. Because the objectives will be able to be viewed by both sides won't necessarily mean that the OPFOR operational intent is exposed and apparent. EXAMPLE: The Germans have orders to ADVANCE to seize and hold hills A,B,and C. The Soviets have orders to DELAY at hills A,B, and C, So the FLAGS would be placed on and around hill A,B, and C. The Germans in this case might assume that they are conducting a normal ADVANCE battle and the force ratio would be to their advantage but that may not be the case at all because of the fact that the SOVIETS have orders to DELAY and may in fact have quite a large force at their disposal and thus the V Hex's have been adjusted to reflect the orders of both sides as well as the force size and disposition. Also consider that with this game system a CG may in fact want the GERMAN OPFOR to seize those objective flags around the hills because he is assembling forces on the two adjacent maps so as to spring a trap and cut off/ envelope his enemy with pincer movements in the next coming segment. The GERMANS may in fact only FEINT toward the objectives and then do something else quite unexpected. With this game system the tactical options are unlimited because a CG has now the time needed to allow his complex maneuver scheme to come to fruition.The options are unlimited and so it will require thoughtful consideration on the part of the Game Master when placing the V Hex's.

I decided on the rules and have play tested them long ago including Z fire limits, artillery fire mission conduct, etc. but I have waited to write them into a format and present them until enough interest is shown in this concept.