France '40 Prucha OOB Question

LordDeadwood · 06-11-2021, 09:45 PM,

Going through the F40 Prucha OOB, I noticed that the German 61. Infantry Division has four regiments listed, one of which appears to be a duplicate - the 151st. The OOB lists the 151. IR twice, then the 162 and 176. I assume this is not intended? Can anyone shed any light on this?
[Image: F40_Prucha_OOB_61_ID.jpg]

Outlaw Josey Wales · 06-11-2021, 11:17 PM,

The one on top goes from 124487 through 124501 and the one on the bottom goes 164475 through 164489. Not exactly a duplicate. The book I have shows three Infantry Rgts. (151st, 162nd, 176th) That was it's formation in 1939.

Plain Ian · 06-11-2021, 11:39 PM,

The second set are all motorised?

Strangely the German 60th Infantry Division became a Motorised unit after the French camapign but these units belong to the 61st?

LordDeadwood · 06-12-2021, 01:19 AM,

(06-11-2021, 11:17 PM)Outlaw Josey Wales Wrote: The one on top goes from 124487 through 124501 and the one on the bottom goes 164475 through 164489. Not exactly a duplicate. The book I have shows three Infantry Rgts. (151st, 162nd, 176th) That was it's formation in 1939.

I agree, it's not a true duplicate, just a duplicate in name. But none of the other inf. divisions I've seen have four regiments, let alone two with the same designation!

LordDeadwood · 06-12-2021, 01:21 AM,

(06-11-2021, 11:39 PM)Plain Ian Wrote: The second set are all motorised?

Strangely the German 60th Infantry Division became a Motorised unit after the French camapign but these units belong to the 61st?

Good point! I hadn't noticed that they were motorized! I'm not able to load up the game right now, I'm curious how it loads up. Looks like it would actually create two 151st regiments, one foot and one motorized.

Plain Ian · 06-12-2021, 01:58 AM,

(06-12-2021, 01:21 AM)LordDeadwood Wrote:
(06-11-2021, 11:39 PM)Plain Ian Wrote: The second set are all motorised?

Strangely the German 60th Infantry Division became a Motorised unit after the French camapign but these units belong to the 61st?

Good point! I hadn't noticed that they were motorized! I'm not able to load up the game right now, I'm curious how it loads up. Looks like it would actually create two 151st regiments, one foot and one motorized.

From Wikipedia...

"During the advance into Belgium the 61st divisions 151st Infantry Regiment linked up with German airborne troops assaulting Fort Eben-Emael on 11 May, the Belgian defenders surrendered the fortifications on the same day."

Possibly that's why the 151st might be motorised in some scenarios?

LordDeadwood · 06-12-2021, 04:19 AM,

I get it... There are two versions of the 151st, depending on the scenario. I was forgetting that the scn file determines which units of the OOB are used... Makes perfect sense now. Thanks!

Plain Ian · 06-12-2021, 04:53 AM,

(06-12-2021, 04:19 AM)LordDeadwood Wrote: I get it... There are two versions of the 151st, depending on the scenario. I was forgetting that the scn file determines which units of the OOB are used... Makes perfect sense now. Thanks!

Well I'm guessing as usual. I do not have France 40 Gold.

I have the old HPS France 40 and the quick check I made was to look at one of the standard alt campaign games. The 61st Infantry Division does not start on the map but comes on as a reinforcement 13th May? Which doesn't tally with Wikapedia?
I looked at 0510_16: The Fall of Eben Emael and that showed the same set up with the only Infantry Division on map being the 269th (part) and 31st and only the 269th being close to the Eben Emael? Its a 7 turn scenario with no reinforcements.

However Mike Prucha did make a lot of changes to the the Gold versions.

Let me know if I am right?

Mike Prucha · 06-12-2021, 02:10 PM,

Hello all,

Historically this regiment was assigned to 4. Panzer on May 10th-11th for the operation to clear the Albert Canal before reverting to its parent division. Its three battalions led each of 4th Panzer's three columns and were responsible for clearing the Belgian infantry out of their trenches before the tanks dashed forward. To recreate this operation, the regiment needed to be motorized. The regiment appeared again in later period scenarios where the motorization was no longer appropriate, hence the duplication. The motor version is under 61. ID because I didn't want it to be stuck with 4. Panzer for the duration of the campaign scenario.

-Mike Prucha

LordDeadwood · 06-12-2021, 10:14 PM,

(06-12-2021, 02:10 PM)Mike Prucha Wrote: Hello all,

Historically this regiment was assigned to 4. Panzer on May 10th-11th for the operation to clear the Albert Canal before reverting to its parent division. Its three battalions led each of 4th Panzer's three columns and were responsible for clearing the Belgian infantry out of their trenches before the tanks dashed forward. To recreate this operation, the regiment needed to be motorized. The regiment appeared again in later period scenarios where the motorization was no longer appropriate, hence the duplication. The motor version is under 61. ID because I didn't want it to be stuck with 4. Panzer for the duration of the campaign scenario.

-Mike Prucha

Thanks Mike! I was wondering why 4. Panzer had an extra infantry regiment, but didn't even notice that the designation was the same. Like I said earlier, I keep forgetting that the OOB file is designed to be used piecemeal with various scenarios. I was looking at in terms of the Fall Gelb scenarios assuming that it was used in it's entirety. I only discovered JTS a little over a year ago and the depth of this system's "simple complexity" continues to amaze me.