quick question

Jim · 11-29-2021, 12:19 AM,

sooo.....a unit doesnt exert a ZOC in a hex he cant enter....i.e. A MOT unit cant exert a ZOC in a marsh hex? Propeller Hat

ComradeP · 11-29-2021, 12:30 AM,

The ZOC rules ignore movement limitations. You can exert a ZOC across a canal/river, or into a hex the unit that exerts the ZOC can't enter.

Jim · 11-29-2021, 12:36 AM,

OK, thanks.....just couldnt understand why the enemy isnt isolated when all hexes around him has a ZOC...unless of course MOT cant put one in a marsh hex then he would have been free to draw supply thru it

ComradeP · 11-29-2021, 01:32 AM,

A friendly ZOC isn't enough to supply a unit surrounded by enemy ZOCs. A friendly unit needs to be adjacent to the unit surrounded by enemy ZOCs in order for the latter unit to be in supply.

Are you sure that the units you're using the isolate the enemy units exert a ZOC? Towed AT guns and heavy AA guns don't exert a ZOC, for example.

Plain Ian · 11-29-2021, 05:30 AM,

At what point in the turn does Isolation take effect? I don't think its immediate so you need to wait a turn to see it?

Jim · (This post was last modified: 11-29-2021, 05:49 AM by Jim.)

Waves at Ian...been awhile my friend. I was sure it was after the Russian took his turn that I noticed he wasnt isolated. I hadnt moved any of my units in the area during that current turn so he had to have been isolated at least the start of MY turn. anyway..no biggie was just curious. Just a solo campaign in S41

Plain Ian · 11-29-2021, 06:36 AM,

(11-29-2021, 05:34 AM)Jim Wrote: Waves at Ian...been awhile my friend. I was sure it was after the Russian took his turn that I noticed he wasnt isolated. I hadnt moved any of my units in the area during that current turn so he had to have been isolated at least the start of MY turn. anyway..no biggie was just curious. Just a solo campaign in S41

Hi Jim.

I've opened up my fav Bulge 44 and played about with Elsenborn to set up a similar situation. I can't see a problem with Marsh and Isolation?

What I do notice though is that Motorised units can enter Marsh? So maybe you mean Swamp?

[Image: Swamp.png]

So here is the II/Gr 752 which was showing Isolated during the German turn before the US unit has moved...which it has now.

I'll look at things with Swamp.

Ian in Dundee

Jim · 11-29-2021, 06:57 AM,

Woww...you could move him into Marsh? I had to go on foot to move MOT INTO marsh. Is this Bulge a Gold version? But it seems obvious you did have a ZOC in the marsh before you moved him. And yes it was a marsh and not a swamp hex...There are both just south of Mogilev. Like I said is no big deal.
Dundee, I have sooooo many of those old PzC games....almost all of them but the most recent three or four. I have begun to buy them back and now I have Smolensk, Stalingrad, and France. Oddly enough...next on my list is either Bulge or Sicily. Not sure why those two, but I used to enjoy the Bulge games.
Jeez Stalingrad has a lotta units lol.

Plain Ian · (This post was last modified: 11-29-2021, 07:23 AM by Plain Ian.)

Jim just read your post but I'll post my map anyway. Swamp makes no difference...in Bulge...anyways. Germans were Isolated during their turn after US moved.

The Engineer units shown are actually motorised but show as non motorised in the game by the way.

I'll check the parameter file in Smolensk? So Marsh is 0 for motorised there?

Green · 11-29-2021, 07:37 AM,

As ComradeP points out above, ZOC's are not based on whether a unit can move into a hex. So the ability to move into marsh or swamp is not the issue. However, movement costs for units can differ across titles. For example marsh is prohibited for motorized units in Smolensk but not Bulge.

But from Kharkov '43 (PzC19) and for the ALT scenarios in titles prior to this, a set of more or less standard movement parameter values are used. Some work still needs to be done on this but players need to be aware that inconsistencies are present in the stock scenarios prior to Kh43. Playing the ALT scenarios is a solution to this.

John