Infrequently and never used features in SB?

[Embis]

In the Squad battles manual that there are several SB features which, to my knowledge, don't seem to have been implemented in any, or many, of the SB games these are:

1. Weapons that use timers
2. Stun Weapons
3. Trains
4. Remote Control vehicles
5. Civilians
6. Hidden, Escape, Cache and hiding objectives
7. Bridge demolition
8. Detection devices (dogs, trip flares)

Is anyone aware of which title, or titles, make use of any of these features? I have a suspicion that although some are present in some games in the series, none are present in all the games and some might not even be present in ANY of the games.

I hope these features will be implemented across the board in some future update of the SB series. They would encourage some interesting new scenario designs that depart from the usual "assault that position" scenario and play to the strengths of a game of this scale. 

In general, when you consider the list above, I think some scenario design with the SB series has suffered from a lack of imagination. The series really lends itself well to small unit engagements, much more so than games on the scale of Panzer Campaigns or Panzer Battles. Some of these under, or never, used features could produce some really entertaining small scenarios if they were more widely implemented and accessible to scenario designers in more of the games. I don’t think there is a period covered by the SB series where civilians might not be seen, where bridge demolition might not be an objective, where prisoners or hostages might not need to be freed, and yet these features aren’t implemented in all the games.

One could start creating custom databases and image files to implement some of these items but who apart from Warhorse, and possibly me,   wants to be effectively designing a new MOD to use a feature?

Anyway, if you do know which if any of the games use any of the above features, or know of a scenario where one of these is implemented please let me know.

(Cross posting this to the JTS opponent group on Facebook)

[Xerxes77]

In the Squad battles manual that there are several SB features which, to my knowledge, don't seem to have been implemented in any, or many, of the SB games these are:

1. Weapons that use timers
2. Stun Weapons
3. Trains
4. Remote Control vehicles
5. Civilians
6. Hidden, Escape, Cache and hiding objectives
7. Bridge demolition
8. Detection devices (dogs, trip flares)

Is anyone aware of which title, or titles, make use of any of these features? I have a suspicion that although some are present in some games in the series, none are present in all the games and some might not even be present in ANY of the games.

(Snip)

Hi Embis,
totally agree with your assessment. There's such a wide variety of tools, it wouldn't surprise me to see some are underused.

That said given the knowledge I've picked up on the series I'd be surprised if most of these features aren't indeed available in most or all of the titles. They just may or may not be accessible depending on the game. Example: you can define Civilians for Red Victory even if the editor won't show you the option, and they will behave correctly (you can see there's even an entry for "captures" in the Victory Dialog).

Regarding the more sophisticated equipment, it may be that it is more prevalent in the post-WW2 games? A few months ago I helped a user in this board to find the missing sounds for a dog, I believe he was using the Afghan war title. Pacific War does include a dog (K-9) with the detection attribute which is apparently used by a "Dog Team" in the campaign.

I don't see a reason why we couldn't have trains, bridge-blowing or timer-based weapons in Red Victory, Pacific War or Grenada though. As you say, they're simply not used. In RV we do have a small assortment of detection devices in the form of IR weapons, etc. Dogs and flares shouldn't be difficult to implement.

But the one flag that really intrigues me is "Beam". This applies to Loads and it's not documented anywhere as far as I can tell. Maybe there's built-in support for a Star Trek mod?

[Embis]

But the one flag that really intrigues me is "Beam". This applies to Loads and it's not documented anywhere as far as I can tell. Maybe there's built-in support for a Star Trek mod? 

 Do you have the Arab Israeli mod? checkout 2050 Armageddon scenario and see the Merkava 3000! There is certainly the potential for a Sc-fi Mod in SB.. not my cup of tea TBH but I bet there would be plenty who would enjoy that.

...I had spotted beam in the database and its on my list to experiment with I have had a brief play with it. I have a feeling it might be a good attribute to attach to a searchlight unit. As the searchlight stands, I think I am right in saying, it only illuminates the hex its directed at.. whereas if it is given the beam attribute it will illuminate everything in its path from the source to the target hex. Much more like the real world IMHO. 

The beam attribute might also might be something that Night Sights could make use of, I think a night sight should be able to pick up every appropriate unit in the line of sight from source to target, not just "illuminate" the target hex.

[Embis]

..In Modern War there is a loadout with the beam attribute, an ADS (Active Denial System) mounted on a Hmmwv...I think i need to go play with that :)

[Xerxes77]

..In Modern War there is a loadout with the beam attribute, an ADS (Active Denial System) mounted on a Hmmwv...I think i need to go play with that :)

Had to look that up - a long-range, non-lethal heat ray? I wonder how that works in game terms!

So Modern War does indeed include some shiny toys. So far I only have RV, PW, SCW and of course Grenada. I look forward to expanding my collection, but the exchange rate in my country is just brutal. To be honest I've held off playing further once I discovered the assault bugs, and I've been distracting myself programming those little utilities which allow me to keep close to the games...  but now there's a very real chance of seeing them fixed in the next iteration so I expect I'll be ready to jump into the fray

[Embis]

So Modern War does indeed include some shiny toys. 

Indeed it does! ..although having said that I think it's a shame Modern War is so narrow in its scope, I would have played it a bit more if it was a little less Americocentric. It would be nice to see a few more NATO units putting in an appearance, a similar thing could be said for many of the WW2 SB series where many nations on the Allied side, notably the Brits, are apparently AWOL or MIA 

[Stejones82]

I am fairly certain that Winter War uses an armored train in at least one scenario. And it has some firepower!

Also, I seem to recall a DBP game recently that used cache objectives. But I agree, there are neat features that are under utilized.

[Embis]

Thanks for all the replies, you have pointed me in the right direction to explore some of the features I am interested in.