Tiller Modern European Campaigns and logistics

[Tempest5]

Like everyone here, I have been watching the Russian Army 'advance' into Ukraine.
I am starting to rethink EVERYTHING I have been lead to believe about the Warsaw Pact in the past.
I am near 69 years old-dependent child from a US Army Sgt stationed in Germany 3 times. Late mother was German (oh she had her opinions on the Red Army.)
We lived in Augsburg, Germany in 1968 when the Red Army rolled in tho Czechoslovakia - so the Red Army/Warsaw Pact is not some abstract entity to me.

While I have no doubt Russian kit can be effective when properly used; the institutional incompetence on display now with the Russian Army has me thinking/assuming it was no better in the decades past. When I was in the USAF in the 1980's I knew from my readings SPEZNATZ/VDV Airborne units would target our airbases. Not impressed (horrified actually) what I am witnessing now on this tactic.


So....is logistics/supply/reliability modeled correctly in the Modern European Campaigns in Europe? How would you edit the OoBs to reflect what you see today of the Russian Army.

Thoughts?

[jonnymacbrown]

[quote pid="449225" dateline="1647787147"]
the institutional incompetence on display now with the Russian Army
[/quote]

Perhaps you can clarify? It took the US Army three weeks to take Baghdad. It's a little over three weeks now for the Russian Army. What are they doing wrong? Not trying to be confrontational. It's difficult to get accurate news. Thanks, jonny
.

[jim pfleck]

The Russians appear to be having massive logistical problems. There are many theories (years of poor maintenance on trucks, inability to secure lines of communication-exasperated by low troop density, poor planning, tether of about 90 miles from railhead) and they all seem to be influencing what is going on (mostly stalled Russian attacks/long operational pause)

[KG_RangerBooBoo]

Well I'm sure the Soviet armed forces of 1985 were different than the Russian forces of today. The full weight of the communist state was behind the armed forces which I don't think has been the case in the last few years.

[Liebchen]

Well I'm sure the Soviet armed forces of 1985 were different than the Russian forces of today. The full weight of the communist state was behind the armed forces which I don't think has been the case in the last few years.

It also blows my mind that Russians would try a blitzkrieg during the Rasputitsa.

[LordDeadwood]

Well I'm sure the Soviet armed forces of 1985 were different than the Russian forces of today. The full weight of the communist state was behind the armed forces which I don't think has been the case in the last few years.

It also blows my mind that Russians would try a blitzkrieg during the Rasputitsa.

Which to me is proof positive that they expected little to no resistance...

[jonnymacbrown]

[quote pid="449244" dateline="1647909415"]
It also blows my mind that Russians would try a blitzkrieg during the Rasputitsa.
[/quote]

All the roads and streets are paved now Liebchen. It's not 1941 anymore.  jonny

[Gray Nemesis]

[quote pid="449244" dateline="1647909415"]
It also blows my mind that Russians would try a blitzkrieg during the Rasputitsa.

All the roads and streets are paved now Liebchen. It's not 1941 anymore.  jonny
[/quote]

Biggest difference from today is the USSR had the Warsaw Pact, while today it's Russia alone. The economy of the USSR while no giant was better insulated from sanctions and other external pressure. Having watched the performance of the Soviets in Afghanistan, Chechnya, and Ukraine I don't think they have had any great military leadership since WW2. If the Russians were defending Russia instead of invading a peaceful neighbor (who much of the population actually likes) I'm sure you would see a better performance by the Russians. As to the modeling of the Mod. Campaign Games I think they are logistically accurate.

[Tempest5]

Well for one thing the US Army did not incur 9800 KIA in 3 weeks heading to Baghdad! Let alone losing assorted Generals.
And they took Baghdad.

The amount of news and RAW information (OSINIT /twitter) available online in mind boggling. Now after you read it all and think about it, keeping in mind FOW and propaganda, you come away seeing the Russians are doing EVERYTHING wrong in OPERATION Z.
Off the top of my head.

1)Poor preliminary intelligence of adversary
2) Failure to gain air superiority or secure airfields
3) Indiscriminate shelling of civilian areas
4) Failure to secure rail lines/nodes to supply army
5) Not enough trucks in good repair to supply army
6) Failure to secure road network for truck convoys
7) VERY insecure communications

I remember various talking retired General/DoD Analysts talking leading up to the invasion about Kiev falling in within 72 hrs before the invasion. Really?! A simple Wikipedia search on the Battle of Hue in Vietnam between the USMC and NVA Regulars and Battle of Falluja with the USMC and Iraqi Insurgents...Both cities took a MONTH to take. And neither of the aforementioned cities are the size of Kiev. For me that was when the scales started to fall from my eyes on what I had read about the Warsaw Pact and started me questioning that forces ability. In short-either the professionals don't know what they are talking about or lying;then and now.

There-I said it.

And as far as Communist state being behind the Army. I don't know about that. Institutional corruption was nothing new in Soviet Russia. Logistics has never been a strong suit for the Red Army. That is hinted oh so slightly in this article on supplying the STAGGERING [eye-watering] amount of ammunition needed in the first 2 weeks by the Warsaw Pact for an attack on NATO in the 1980's. Mind you we are not even talking about food and fuel .... traveling in a war ravaged road/rail network with destroyed and damaged bridges in a darken landscape...with sabotage and air attacks.

https://www.alternatewars.com/WW3/WW3_Do...N-1989.htm

These various links I found in other sites forum posts got me to thinking about how I should look at Red Army logistics during the earlier 'Cold War' era. One is a gaming site.

https://rockymountainnavy.com/2022/03/09...my-supply/

https://warontherocks.com/2021/11/feedin...logistics/

https://www.scmglobe.com/russian-logisti...f-ukraine/

Anyway-that is all I have. Enjoy.

[wildb]

This video has some rather severe implications for the Russian army.

https://youtu.be/u5YevpOS7t4?t=9

Thugs bullying the Russian army.

Made by the Podcast of the Lotus Eaters.

The video implies that Putin is using the Russian mafia to control the military. Can you imagine a western military bases paying protection money to the mafia.