FOF loaded!

[Kingmaker]

HiHi

Right to give you some sort of perspective on the state of my, “experience”, with FoF PBEM, I have been involved in 5 so far, 2 against a chap that was somewhat impatient and tactically inept and went off in a Huff blaming it all on faults within the game, I ditched those files so no info there.

1 completed game and one currently on the go v’s Frank, and 1 other with another Blitz member on hold as he is “Out of Town” for a while.

Info from my PBEM folder

1st game v Frank, walloped in 49 turns, starting 23-03-08, finishing 19-04-08, playing an average of 4 turns a day. (November game start date)

Second game v Frank, to date, 42 turns (the walloping looks on the cards again :-( ), starting 19-04-08, again average about 4 turns a day. (July game start date)

We have really been hammering the returns in over the weekends so the average is somewhat iffy, and please bear in mind Frank is a very, very good player with lots of experience through FoF Beta testing so the quickness in game completed time is not really that good an indication of how long an average game might last.

On hold game v Krec, 9 turns starting 12-04-08 on hold from 19-04-08 average 1 turn a day.

I have emailed the guys at GWS and am keeping fingers crossed (makes typing bloody awkward!) they will get back to me offering assistance with Data re time taken for games during the beta testing etc.

Mmmm, I think Franks experience is showing when he suggests an average of ½ hour to do a turn, I would suggest an average of 1 hour, but then maybe I’m slow.

The following is how I see things and therefore open to question;

Complexity, I will try and give some context but I only really have in-depth experience from playing BG ACW/Waterloo games (Motorised transport!? In War!? Don't be silly boy it would scare the Horses!" exit stage left one outraged Col Blimp) so I am gonna have to compare against Gettysburg & Chickamauga (my 2 favourites). Apart from the basic difference between the strategy nature of FoF & the close order tactics of BG games, actual game play is also different in that with say G’burg you have (even allowing for Fog of War) complete visual input on the screen to guide your actions in the battle, if you have the movement points you can move stuff and it will go, you can see exactly how much supply you have and where & when the next lot is coming from, Arty ammo is fixed at the start of the game, etc, etc Well with FoF basically you don’t have any of that, the complexity comes in the juggling of your recourses.

So, as a simplified example, the South (I have only played the Good guys, so I know nothing about Feds set up) is way, way deficient in Iron compared to the Feds and desperately needs to build an Iron foundry (doubles Iron output in that city), OK, fine, build one! ... it takes 24 turns and eats up both money and labour, something the South is again chronically short of (actually the only thing the south ain’t really short on is courage), ... but I gotta have iron for my forts and armaments, ... well you can’t build your forts without labour & money, ... which you have just spent on your foundry ... OK, leave the foundry till later then ... but it takes 24 turns I need Iron desperately NOW!

And so it goes on for each resource, for every state, for every unit, how do I allocate my given resources and build for the future in a balanced way (the game is very unforgiving if you get it wrong) while keeping Yankee hordes out of the Goat pens (I’ve have heard the stories about Yankee sexual atrocities!).

Movement is again starkly different between the game systems, in FoF you can’t just point you units in the direction you want them to go, pat them on the head and wait for them to go, all sorts of other factors can intervene such as the Weather, the initiative of the Commander, the phase within a turn that events happen, the availability of rail transport etc. It can be highly frustrating when your units don’t go when or where you ordered them to, but that is in someways part of the realistic nature of the game, think about the cock-up involving Beauregard’s orders to the army before Shiloh, or the Peninsular campaign etc. From the bitter experience of having a Corps command by my highest initiative commander, i.e. Lee, caught and badly mauled by a much larger army I can appreciate how much this game is out to get you! :(

Mmmm, :chin: reading back over this I’m aware I might be waffling, losing the plot or whatever and not supplying the info you need so I will close this down, if you feel more comparisons, re complexity are needed then let me know, suffice to say in my opinion FoF is far more complex as a game than BG G’burg/Chickamauga, and should be scored so.

Briefly, again my opinion, something along these lines might work, either scoring for the 5 scenarios at game level i.e. Basic, Intermediate, Advanced, or, alternatively make a Command decision that Blitz will only support FoF at Advanced level to start with (that may be the way to go till further Data comes in, I seriously doubt many folk will PBEM at Basic level more than once, but then again, that could be the route out of Bootcamp ??)

The game really doesn’t have a Minor win/loose setup unless agreed between the two players on a voluntary basis.

A Draw score at a half way mark should be included to allow players the choice of honourably agreeing one , e.g. an unforeseen time factor forcing one player to need out, again a voluntary thing but one I feel should be catered for.

So a limited (very) comparison for scoring might be

BG Gettysburg historical at 149 turns, Major victory = 70 points

FoF July start 100 (120?) turns, victory = 70 pts + whatever for complexity etc.

Looser points as for G’burg above but something extra for the complexity etc.

Right, “Nuff for now”, but please do come back for anything you feel I may be able to help with, and Ill try and supply.

All the Best
Peter