Grumblers musing

[The Real Rake]

Understandable about your concerns with Friendly Fire. They take some getting used to, when they were first introduced, I also had my fair share of losses. Initially, I was annoyed, but the more I played, the more I enjoyed having the feature. Rarely now do I misclick in the dozens of games I have played now, but it happens. Unfortunately, Blue on Blue happens.

Noted, and I do know that blue on blue happens.  I prefer to play the game in 2D, but since I now play primarily with a 46" TV as my monitor, I'm sitting approximately 8' from the screen.  The extreme zoom-in has helped a lot, but it's still sometimes difficult with my aging eyes.  As a result, I've begun using 3D more than I used to.  I've found that I need to be very careful clicking in 3D to make sure I'm selecting the correct hex.  This isn't a problem when firing at a hex with multiple units since a selection box pops up. Far too often, I curse myself when a unit other than the one I thought I had selected goes traipsing down the road.  Since blue-on-blue, I've added new choice words to that vocabulary when I start shooting at my units.

Since I typically play against the AI, any chance that HAL mis-clicks?   .  With the new Adaptive AI (which I do like), surely this should be possible.

As Jason put it so well:

Hidden results in Extreme Fog of War is part of making the Extreme part of the Optional Rule more prevelant. It was really insignificant before, now it is very significant. The information is all still there, it just isn't there instantaneously like one was used to from playing the old games. It requires a few moments to dig that information out, with the intention or representing combat at the command level one is typically playing.

The blue highlight says it all. In the real-time FOW of actual combat, the higher level force commander (represented by you, the player) would not know casualties to any detail, instantaneously. (Each turn representing six minutes of "real time", right?) The force commander would have to take the time and effort to "dig" for such info.

Especially for EFOW, the intent is to move away from God-like, know-it-all, real-time omniscience.

My thinking is this...  I get that the overall commander (in this case, me) might not have all the "real time" intelligence.  But, the commander on the ground (at this scale, typically the battalion commander,  certainly the company CO) should have a pretty good idea of what's happening in his sector.  He should have an feel for whether the troops he's facing have been damaged (unknown), disrupted (available from the unit menu) or demoralized (hidden by FOW) enough to warrant an assault.  If unsure, I would presume the CO would be savvy enough to send some scouts to find out (beyond the scale of this game).  This is a decision that can and should be made without authority from the division CO.

The information is readily available from the Strength report... one click to open, one more to close.  All this really does is add a layer of bookkeeping to the game.  Now, I need to keep a list of all the damaged units to compare against those reported in the Strength reports.  I keep enough notes at work; it's frustrating to have to do this in a game.

Without the data available in the Strength report, one wouldn't know whether they're facing three platoons or three half-squads.  The game doesn't provide many other clues about the firepower emanating from a hex.  I guess I understand the thinking that went behind the decision to remove the information from the damage report; I just don't feel that it was extrapolated far enough.

That said, in ME 1.01, for EFOW only, we will change the "unknown effects against unknown units" to, for example, something like "losses inflicted" or "no losses inflicted", without spelling out the precise details. So make EFOW a bit less extreme, and make the Damage Report box not quite so useless. 

I think this is a good start...  it'll save some unnecessary clicking  

Again, as I said in my original post, I think there's a lot to like about the changes in the game.  And, I certainly appreciate the time and effort extended to revive one the few wargames that have survived the test of my time.  I may eventually get used to the changes to EFOW just as I'm slowly getting used to EA.  I detested EA when it first came out, but have started using it in ME as I assumed that the new scenarios were designed with this in effect...  I'm beginning to get a feel for EA, but I'm not sure how I'd get that feeling without knowledge of losses being sustained by enemy troops.

Yup. Bought it.................


.......... Thanks team!

Ed... my apologies for hijacking the thread

Rake