Germany as AI

[Gris]

I think the Soviets should be restricted, as seems to be the view on Matrix too.  I have no idea why Russia is allowed to build support and divisions to their pleasure, limited only by manpower, while Germany is not.  Why not restrict them to the units that actually appeared, when they appeared?  So far I have only built a single Russian infantry division (still turn 13) just to see how it works, and I am finding at this point the numerous units appearing each turn are more than enough.  Against a human, I am not sure, but against the AI all seems good to go.

Ok Weasel, I'll bite, I know I am not going to win this one, but I'll try. 

It is not the number of units that matter, it is the number of units with a ZOC. Soviet CV is not the weapon of choice in 1941. It is the ZOC which cost the Axis movement. The Soviets are restricted by Admin points. If you followed the historical schedule, then there is no payoff for your large Axis encirclements. And what happens if they are not destroyed in the encirclements? Do you reward the Soviet player, or penalize the Axis? The answer is opinionated. If you encircle enough units they won't come back fast enough and in full strength. Also does this include the Air Force too? Or Factory evac, historically the Soviet got them all out. Not to mention players would use the schedule to game the system. 

The other difficulty is it is easy to balance AI play. You cannot balance a HTH game. It is the Holy Grail. Has never happened and never will. The best you can do is give both sides a reasonable chance to win or recreate history (you can't have both of those either in the same game). Player skill is not programmable. 

From a gameplay point of view, if you restrict the Soviets to a historical OOB, it would be boring, in 6 months the game would die off (my opinion, not fact based). What makes the Soviet play exciting IMHO is not surviving 1941, but winning in 1945. Most players just never play it that far. Play the Bagration scenario, that is one of the best ones. I enjoyed that one more than playing the Axis in 41. 

I think the point that is missed is from a game design perspective (not a historical one), the game is designed around the fixed Axis OOB vs rebuilding the Soviet OOB.  The fixed OOB's war in russia games have been done (ad nauseum I might add). Giving the Axis player the ability to build OOB will cause a whole bunch of other problems (starting with Soviets players wanting to go back to fixed Axis OOB, you can't win). Look what happen with the transport of fuel to panzer units in the beginning. That produced some crazy results. 

Ok, hang on, here is where it gets rough.

With all that said, if they want to give the Axis the ability to do that, they probably need to do it for WITE 2. You would have to completely revamp WITE in order for it to work. I know I am in the minority on this one. I will admit I tend to take games at face value. If that is what the designer gave me, then I figure out how to win within the system, not redesign the system so I can win. The real question being asked is this. Can you change this for me, the Axis player, so I can beat the Soviet player who has more skill than I do? It would be quicker and easier than me learning to play better. It's harsh I admit, but that has been my experience with such sweeping request like these. Not directed at you my friend in any way, but towards wargaming in it's current state today, this is my impression from forums for many games, too many players are trying to design games instead of playing them (thanks to the internet!). Pick just about any game and within 24 hrs after release, the players are redesigning it. In less than a day they have mastered the game. Armed with their expert opinion they tell the designer and community what needs to be done to save the game..................... (Dramatic, I know, but I am trying to win, don't even get me started on Steam reviews, lol)

I think it was Mark Herman, an experienced game designer,  who said, "you can't balance a game based on bad play".  

One last point, a fixed OOB is pretty historical. The Wehrmacht leadership often argued with Hitler on this and that, yet Hitler ignore them. So as the player, you can ask to change the OOB, but the Fuhrer won't let you. It is part of the historical play and thus an important part of the game.

Just sayin' 

Ok, all my ammo is out, I'll have to take cover and reload. But for what is worth, this why I disagree with the Axis getting an OOB. Honestly I think there are bigger problems in wargame design than areas like this, but will only get fixed when we the players quit asking for it. Subject for another thread some day.

See you on the Steppe!