2012 Ladder scoring has problems

[PawelM]

I will repeat that again -like mantra :)-I personally look at ELO and win ratio...
I am also in favour of point reward for testing.....

Also personally I am not bothered about the points as per Outlaw post :)

If noone at blitz takes points seriously-as per all posts- and thinks good player is decided by ELO and win ratio, then what is the point of crowning the champion based on points in the ladder? :)

Last year point champion had over hundred games with over 2500 points with win ratio over 0.5. This year leader has over 2000 with around 50 games and win ratio around 0.3........

Is that an intent to have a 'competition' for a champion based on the criterion everyone claims is meaningless? And if it is so meaningless why everone thinks testers will be attracted by this meaningless reward?

If points are meaninless scrapin champion crown for it is sensible?
if they are not maybe revision of awarded points is sensible ?

I am just playing devil's advocate here :)[/size]

[Kool Kat]

If no one at blitz takes points seriously-as per all posts- and thinks good player is decided by ELO and win ratio, then what is the point of crowning the champion based on points in the ladder? :)

Is that an intent to have a 'competition' for a champion based on the criterion everyone claims is meaningless? And if it is so meaningless why everone thinks testers will be attracted by this meaningless reward?

Your premise is wrong. Re-read my Post #4 and other posts in this thread. Note, not everyone believes the awarding of points for other club activities is meaningless?

I believe the Blitz is a stronger and better club than many... for the sole reason we do reward players for participating and giving back to our gaming community in many different ways; developing & testing H2H scenarios, writing book reviews, AAR's, and a myriad of other activities.

Here at the Blitz, the title "champion" is rewarded to many players... based on their points... and in some cases has nothing to do with how many games they have won? :1st place:

Again, as Ed and others have stated... "what's wrong with that?"

BTW... Mike (Warhorse) posted earlier in this thread and I also made several threads too... currently, there are many opportunities to give back to our community as a H2H scenario play tester? You will be rewarded points.

[Herr Straße Laufer]

What is a point champion?

Ladder points for H2H testing, submitting articles, winning tournaments (extra points), etc. has been ongoing for quite some time. The H2H testing area was a ghost town until points were offered to testers. Even now it is hard to get testers.
I'm thankful that Ash takes an interest and makes an effort to test scenarios and run tournaments. For me, he can lead the ladder.

You should have been around when the ladder points and tables of ranks were reset. :lecture:
Some members complained about losing their status as "Marshal", even though three quarters of all the club's members were "Marshals" (then you needed 2k points to become get to Marshal status).
It was also interesting that the ones who objected, and wrote, the most said they did not care about rank.

I look at win/loss first and ELO second. I know others look to ELO first. For me ELO was added to the ladders after I joined the club. I did/do use it for tournament placements.



HSL

[PawelM]

I believe the Blitz is a stronger and better club than many... for the sole reason we do reward players for participating and giving back to our gaming community in many different ways; developing & testing H2H scenarios, writing book reviews, AAR's, and a myriad of other activities.

Here at the Blitz, the title "champion" is rewarded to many players... based on their points... and in some cases has nothing to do with how many games they have won? :1st place:

Again, as Ed and others have stated... "what's wrong with that?"

I never said there was anything wrong wrong with awarding points for other things than games....

I only tipped the rewards are high for testing in such a way that 20 test games with reports can give the player nearly 2400 ladder points, which requires in excess of 100 normal games with good results. But if this is a consious decision by the club I accept this. I only raised it in case someone did not consider such a scenario. If it was considered and consious decission it changes the things....:respect2:

It seems I got the points idea in sport manner, i.e. team with highest wins gets more points. Mr KK. has now explained to me that points champion is more of the achievement in a wider sense, i.e. extensive activity in terms on numbers of games as well as serving the community by for instance testing the games which was decided is more valuable input.

Now, I am clear .... Silly me :)

HSL,

I never intedend any criticism of Ash or any player doing lots of testing and being rewarded with points for their input. Ashley's input to the club is unquestionable.

The discussion was solely regarding the scoring....

[PawelM]

If the points are a measure of a wider achievemens and contribution as per my post above I think we should introduce bonuses for approved h2h , supported mods, running the tournaments etc... These are in my view things which are as worth of the reward as game testing.

Or do we already do it ?

[Herr Straße Laufer]

Here are some of the bonus's offered:

H2H FAQ
How many bonus points will I earn?
You will be awarded 20 points per scenario Size Modifier. Full bonus points will only be awarded by the H2H Commander once the report has been filled out correctly.

The Parade Ground - general forums

Twenty Questions
A trivia forum in the classic twenty questions format. Get the Question correct, receive bonus points and post the next one!

WW2 Military History Quiz
Quiz questions about WW2 Military History. Answer the question correctly, receive bonus points and post the next question!

WW2 Military Picture Quiz
Quiz Pictures about WW2 Military History. Guess the Picture correctly, receive bonus points and post the next Picture!

As far as I know there are still bonus points for submitting AAR's, articles, etc.?
There used to be bonus points awarded for the winner of tournaments while the tournament director and participants got a "badge/medal" related to the tournament (if so created).
Look around the club site. I think many of the bonus issues are addressed.
You can even see what a member received in bonus points by clicking on their member page and scrolling to the bottom to click their bonus link?

What the officers of the club feel is worthy of reward is often rewarded?

BTW, my main objection to this thread is the title of the thread itself. Bonus points have been around since I first joined the club. Most were for winning tournaments. Early rewards were usually a pat on the back through a forum post or private message. Some club officers, at the time, did not want to give out any bonus points. Then the flood gates opened.
To state there is a problem, where there is no problem, sorta becomes what looks like a problem (when it isn't a problem)?



HSL

[Kool Kat]

As far as I know there are still bonus points for submitting AAR's, articles, etc.?

Yes indeed!

Both for the writing of book reviews and AAR's, players are awarded 25 points each! :1st place:

What the officers of the club feel is worthy of reward is often rewarded? :Witch Pot:

Correct again!

[PawelM]

Please someone correct me if I am wrong but I do not see bonuses for supported mods and apporved h2h scenario.. Surely if a quiz is an input worth rewarding then a point reward for developing the game or new scenario has to be as well

As for title problem.... In my view the thread has a lot merit and the discussion here is merit based friendly chat.... Therefore I must say I am happy that the only problem is the title :)

but if that is an issue I am sure moderators can step in and help :)

[Kool Kat]

Please someone correct me if I am wrong but I do not see bonuses for supported mods and apporved h2h scenario.. Surely if a quiz is an input worth rewarding then a point reward for developing the game or new scenario has to be as well

Ed just listed the bonus criteria (Post #16) for play testing and submitting test reports for H2H scenarios? Click on the "Bonuses" section (under the player's profile) for Warhorse (Mike), Ashcloud (Ashley), Kool Kat (me) or any number of other Blitzers... and you will see a list of bonus points for play testing and / or developing H2H scenarios?

Note - not all bonus points are listed... since in some cases it is up to the discretion of officers to reward points to individuals for their achievements as they deem appropriate.

[PawelM]

So there are bonuses for scenario development....I wish someone said it earliier..... :)

Bonuses at the discretion are not listed....... Out of curiosity: Are they secret or they are made known to other club members via forum?