intelligence

[wonderwall]

hi all folks. I truly admire the series but there is one thing that i think would be usefull. I mean intelligence.

many times germany lost to ruskies by simply russia covering german secrets, movement of the divisions, plans, armaments supply etc. WHAT IF implement something of intelligence , service in PzC?

Its not so easy but for exemple it would be for russians for example that german HQ would be visible... with actual state (out of command). Well maybe you have better ideas.

[FLG]

There is something similar in the modern campaigns. Electronic warfare is represented and enemy HQ's can be identified and jammed.

In WWII they mayhave been able to detect an enemy HQ by sigint but in the timecales of PzC it is doubtful the data could have been acted on. First the signals have to be collected, then analysed, the data transmitted up the appropriate chain of command, down the next one and then the data has to be relayed into the battlefield. Realistically you are talking days.

This idea would be more meaningful if the game was played at timescales of week long turns, instead of hours.

[glennav8]

Good Idea,how about a Intel report prior to each turn? moral of various units,convoy positions,....

[Sgt Barker]

The biggest problem with intel is as FLG said - scale. Intel, beyond what we have now with spotting, recon aircraft and scouting, in the heat of battle with 2 hour turns just doesn't seem real in WWII.

Another problem with intel is that to be realistic a game *must* give bad intelligence some of the time, e.g. identify units that are not there. That's what really happens. An intelligence model that only returns more info about what's really there isn't really an intelligence model, more of a super power spotting model.

[wonderwall]

I was not talking about signals but spying, capturing HQ stab, capturing maps from HQ etc....
in Kursk battle russians have got every detail of information about germans from swiss spy. for instance

in a game like PzC it should be implemented like this. A player would ask for intel for a specific division, and regardless of time luck etc in a time of several turns the place where div stats should be visible to the player.

also sometimes U have a chance of examination of captured soldiers,. They also have many informations for example exact division strenght.

[Dog Soldier]

wonderwall,

The Lucy spy ring in Switzerland was able to give strategic information about Operation citadel to the Russian command. The information was of a nature when the battle was likely to start, number of German formations etc. There was no relevant tactical information that Lucy could provide once the engagement began.

The historical scenarios take into account the Lucy data. The Russians are well prepared to meet the German attack on the Kursk salient.

Dog Soldier

[wonderwall]

wonderwall,

The Lucy spy ring in Switzerland was able to give strategic information about Operation citadel to the Russian command.
Dog Soldier

hmm dont get me wrong but i have other informations. As far i reckon from my memory i sometime red about Kursk battle that russians got every detail informations from day to day. They knew exact marching orders for any division. I remember that a good explanation for some successes from southern part of battle was that a certain german unit (?korps) which for some reasons didnt do what was told, from higher HQ !