Mine kampf

[Dog Soldier]

I do not know much about CM, but I do know a mine field without covering fire is a waste of resources.

A nice MG to mow down the engineers is always a good bet. AT weapons to start mixing it up with the stalled armor is good also. This is esp. effective if the AT fire after the MG has drawn the armor's attention. The tankers will not react until after that first shot or two hits home. Set up the AT to take advantage of side shots.

Seems wrong that anti-personnel mine will not have a chance to immobilize most armored vehicles. They certainly could blow the tires off an AC or the tread off a tank.

[PoorOldSpike]

A MINEFIELD STAYS DANGEROUS THE WHOLE GAME, it just keeps on exploding, but the detonation chance seems to get lower and lower after each explosion as if the field is slowly depleting..
In this test I ran a bunch of panzers up and down the dirt road over the buried AT-minefield for 30 turns and they were being blown up at intervals over the whole 30 tns, the minefield exploded 13 times and destroyed or immobd all the 13 tanks in this pic.
PS - Interestingly, when the first tank was blown up, the rest of the column jammed their brakes on and auto-plotted routes around the mines, but when I then cancelled the plots and ordered them to go straight through the mines, they obeyed most of the time even though they were getting blown up..

[PoorOldSpike]

CONFIRMATION - ARTILLERY CLEARS MINES


PIC 1 - A selection of German arty spotters of all calibres (81mm to 170mm) target the Russian buried AT-minefield at the crossroads. (They can't see it of course but we know it's there for the test)






PIC 2 - After all the barrages end, the Panzer II's move straight through the minefield without exploding any, that's why the mine icon hasn't appeared on the map. Conclusion -the arty must have cleared the mines.






PIC 3 - The view from the Russian side shows their mine icon is still there and it looks quite normal, there's no way to tell it's empty and harmless.
(noob note - the Russian infantry in the woods mis-identify some of the Pz II's and think they're Pz III's, there's extreme fog-of-war for you, very realistic)






PIC 4 - HOWEVER in this second test below I only fired an 81mm mortar barrage (total 150 rounds) but the minefield remained active and immobd the first panzer that tried to cross it, and the mine icon appears. (The rest jammed on their brakes as soon as it appeared and plotted around it)
CONCLUSION -Arty clears minefields but you need lots of medium or heavy-calibre shells to do it, so it's hardly worth bothering in most situations.

[RNL Tiger]

I was curious if mines would be triggered by both friend and foe. Curiousity killed the cat - or in this case friendly units were unable to thread their way through the minefield even though they knew it was there - they trigger the mines...

The key then is to remember where the edges of the minefield are and to go around if you really must move near it. Ideally, of course, you should never need your units to go near your own mines.

[PoorOldSpike]

'FRIENDLY' MINES CLARIFICATION (AT and AP)

First the bad news - They blow you up as well as blowing up the enemy.

Secondly the good news - you can always see your own mines and avoid them...:)

Incidentally German AND Russian mine icons use german language 'Achtung Minen', but the colour indicates whose they are (blue=Ger, red=Russ)

[RNL Tiger]

[quote=PoorOldSpike]




(Note - Even if any kind of mine explodes it doesn't vanish, it still remains 'live' and deadly til the end of the game (unless cleared)

This is shown sitting nicely in the grid but you could place them across two or three grids in battle. Is the mine effect restricted to only one grid [which then contains all of the mines] or multiple grids with the split determined by the actual placement?

[PoorOldSpike]

No matter where the icon is placed the field is always only 20m square

[Okimaw]

So we see that the off board heavy and medium arty will clear a minefield with considerable effort. How about the 50 & 80 mm mortars carried by some men attached to infantry and engineering units? Is the 50 big enough and do the on board mortars carry enough shells?

[PoorOldSpike]

The 81 mortar barrage (150 shells) in the earlier screenshot didn't clear the mines so I shouldn't think 50mm's have any chance either

[McIvan]

'FRIENDLY' MINES CLARIFICATION (AT and AP)

First the bad news - They blow you up as well as blowing up the enemy.

Secondly the good news - you can always see your own mines and avoid them...:)

Incidentally German AND Russian mine icons use german language 'Achtung Minen', but the colour indicates whose they are (blue=Ger, red=Russ)

Will add here that if you accidentally trigger one of your own minefields (most commonly by routing through it), even if the minefield is out of sight of the enemy, it will be revealed to them. So don't rely on the enemy running into it in future.....just one of the quirks of the engine.