Interesting news over at Matrix guys.......

[Zemke]

I see the search continues for the Holy Grail of another Combat Mission successor. Recently I have restarted all my old games of CM, after a long hiatus, (sorry guys on the extra long delay, had some things to work through). I bought CMSF with the hope that the WW II edition would be the Holy Grail we seek, but sadly it is not. According to BattleFront, the market is "Real Time" games, and thus CMSF is geared to RT play, which it is, and which I HATE. Also, according to BattleFront MOST people played Combat Mission against their computer or the AI and not Human Opponents, so it is not a friendly H2H game, either for PBEM (files size huge) or TCIP (Real Time only, no WEGO). Where they got that information, I don't know. If others companies can still make great wargames, HPS, 2by3, SSG and the designers of PC Winter Storm, Koios Works, then Battle Front are sell outs to the lowest common denominator, and it is all about the money for them, not making great wargames like they are so proud of saying. I have been so let down by CMSF. They missed the mark for a true successor to the Combat Mission Series, sad to say. I never wanted to be a Company Commander AND a Stryker Driver at the same time. Don't get me wrong on CMSF there are some really cool things about it, great artillery model and the map editor is real good, but it is NOT Combat Mission no matter what they say. SO.....with all that said, this Matrix Panzer Campaigns Winter Storm sounds interesting, I download the Demo as this is written.

[PoorOldSpike]

Winter Storm is better than CM in some respects, but not in others and vice-versa, so it's impossible to say which is 'best' because their overall style, format and presentation are so different, we might as well try to say which is 'best', cricket or baseball, soccer or American Football, Star Trek or Stargate etc, it just can't be done.
For example Winter Storms realistic landscape graphics blow my socks off more than CM ever can, but on the other hand CM encompasses many more vehicle types, theatres and time periods.
So its fun to play both games..:)

PS - As for BFront, as I've said before it beats me why they didn't develop CM further by bringing out a range of add-ons and expansion packs such as 'Poland 1939', 'France 1940', 'Pacific War', 'D-Day', "Siegfried Line', 'Korea', 'Vietnam', 'Arab-Israeli Wars', 'Falklands', 'Gulf Wars', and possibly even other periods such as the American Revolution, American Civil War, English Civil War, Napoleonic, Crimean War etc, plus hypotheticals like 'German invasion of Britain', ''NATO v Warsaw Pact', 'US Invasion of mainland Japan' etc.

[Mad Russian]

I don't really see the point in lacking micro and bean counting in a tactical level wargame. What is the player supposed to do then? I don't buy this as a great design idea.

What does a Company commander do? Or a Battaloin commander?

They give the orders that are followed by the companies and platoons.

There is enough micro management in the game that it's not all dry give 2 commands and see what happens.

A wego game is a battle chess, nothing more. It's meaningless to fake a battalion commander simulator. That should operate in realtime and with limited battle awareness and with significant command delays.

Different people see things differently. POS and I are often on different sides of the same coin. We both still like CM...just for different reasons.

Wargaming is like that too. Not everybody likes them for the same reasons and we don't all like the same ones.

I recommend you try the demo and see for yourself what you think of it. Don't just take a discussion of the game as what you base your opinion on.

Good Hunting.

MR

[von Nev]

Wow, Matrix seems to be on to something with PC. The graphics look great and I am interested in hearing more of the gameplay. I will be following this game closely and I look forward to POS's writeup on the game.

Marty

[Extraordinarius]

Winter Storm looks to be the latest in a long line of tactical games which should start with a truthful announcement of

"We have a beautiful set of graphics which are slightly beyond the capablilties of your current computer. We are releasing the alleged game right now to attract your attention, and by the time you have a machine that will run it, we hope to have the game functioning."

HUH?

WS looks like any machine bought within the last 5 years should crunch it to pieces no problems. Anyone thinking different should look at how much more graphicaly intensive main stream releases are.

I did not have a machine that would run CMAK at all until November 2006. My current vid card still will not show fog. I operate on the assumption that it is not worth the risk of buying any game (other than the low-graphics HPS offerings) released within the last three years, and my funds are very limited.

[Der Kuenstler]

All they have to do to make me happy is completely copy the CMBB/CMAK model but make it look prettier, add horses, more terrain, 1:1 rendering, maybe add a few civilians and livestock running around, and make a few fortification and air support adjustments and I'd gladly buy it.

[British Tommy]

Civilians and livestock running amok on the battlefield??? no thanks!
Horses and wagons yes. But I fear the type of game you want is still many years away :(

[Extraordinarius]

All they have to do to make me happy is completely copy the CMBB/CMAK model but make it look prettier, add horses, more terrain, 1:1 rendering, maybe add a few civilians and livestock running around, and make a few fortification and air support adjustments and I'd gladly buy it.

"Prettier' and "1:1 rendering" is one of the reasons CM:SF is really bad. The battlefields are very small - preposterously small for a modern battle - because so much memory is committed to showing each individual grunt. I'd happily pay for CMBO updated to the CMAK standard with another round of debugging, e.g. status of unit markers not visible.

[Fullhouse]

For those that think CMSF or PC are graphically intensive I post the following:

This is graphixxxxx notice the 1:1
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zYC45WcIVjU

I just want CM but as preeetiee as in the video I link.

[Der Kuenstler]

I just want CM but as preeetiee as in the video I link.

Yeah now that was cool - put in a train like that and a slo-mo feature, too. What I think would be cool about civilians is show them all scatter into their basements to get out of the way as the tanks advance and then if any of them are killed your men could lose global morale or points...I like the idea of putting other things in the battlefield (not military related) that would effect your strategy - like say - how would a large herd of cattle in the road effect your approach? Or traffic jams of refugees on the roads often hindered progress. Or maybe in France you could gather intelligence from the townspeople about German whereabouts. dogs could bark at you and give you away - stuff like that. WWII was more than just men in grey vs men in green uniforms in empty towns.