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Dog Fight - Ostkreig Tournament Round 2
08-07-2008, 07:34 AM, (This post was last modified: 09-25-2008, 12:46 PM by Dog Soldier.)
#1
Dog Fight - Ostkreig Tournament Round 2
This is the second installment of the Ostkrieg tournament. RickyB plays the part of the nasty Russian commander bent on revenge against the Hitlerite forces ravaging the Motherland.

Dog Soldier does his best to be a dutch boy and plug all the holes in the line!

RickyB brings a seriously big bat when he hits the dike.

Dog Soldier
Fast is fine, but accuracy is everything.
- Wyatt Earp
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08-07-2008, 08:05 AM,
#2
RE: Dog Fight - Ostkreig Tournament Round 2
Looking forward to this one, boy oh boy, two of the OpC heavyweights going head to head!!!!! :smoke: :kill:
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08-07-2008, 11:21 PM, (This post was last modified: 08-07-2008, 11:22 PM by enigma6584.)
#3
RE: Dog Fight - Ostkreig Tournament Round 2
I'm ready, got my reading glassed on!:cool:
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08-23-2008, 08:11 AM,
#4
RE: Dog Fight - Ostkreig Tournament Round 2
AAR Plugging the Dyke (H2H)
S42 Scenario 1212_02 Chir River_PBEM (HTH)
Axis player Dog Soldier
Allied player RickyB

Overview
This is a HTH version of the stock Chir River scenario modified by Foul and tested on the blitz HTH site. The game has been tweaked to promote a more even match for PBEM play. Optional rules that are required by the play testing are the defaults: Artillery Set Up, Virtual Supply Trucks, Low Visibility Air Effects, Night Fatigue, and Limited Air Recon. Programmed Weather is turned off. Recon Spotting is optional and will be used in our game.

Dog Soldier
Fast is fine, but accuracy is everything.
- Wyatt Earp
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08-23-2008, 08:28 AM,
#5
RE: Dog Fight - Ostkreig Tournament Round 2
Forces
The Germans
7th LW Field Division
Assets – Numbers. This unit constitutes about half the Axis forces. I will need their ZOC’s more than the units themselves. The infantry have an AT capability as they are jaegers (HA = 4/1). They will be able to repel Soviet tanks if the T-34’s are used piecemeal.
Liabilities – D morale level. The division is very brittle and will not survive heavy fighting for long.
Friends – Other German infantry with higher morale to stiffen this unit.
Enemies – Everything Russian. Especially T-34’s.

336th ID
Assets – B morale, HA (hard attack) values.
Liabilities – This division is spread very thin and will not be able to concentrate. It’s best use will be to corset the weaker LW infantry. This unit will also be involved in the Sulatsky bridgehead and the south east along facing the 3rd Guards Cavalry.
Friends – 11th PD tanks.
Enemies – Russian artillery. Massed waves of Soviet infantry to overwhelm these units.

11th PD
Assets – A morale, strong panzer units, PzGr infantry which can take on and beat any Russian units.
Liability – This unit is the fire brigade to “plug the dike”. It will be needed everywhere. It can only be best used when it stays concentrated. Thus covering the flanks of this unit will be hard as the Axis is so short in the number of units in this scenario compared to the Russians.
Friends – Other infantry to cover the flanks
Enemies – Russian artillery. I do not consider the T-34’s in this scenario a true enemy of this unit. The 11th PD can defeat the Russian tanks in detail. Do not let the Russian 1st Tank Corps and 5th Mech. Corps to link up!

The Russians
Mobile units
Elements of 1st Tank Corps and 5th Mech. Corps
Assets – T-34’s There are five under strength T-34 Rgts in 5th Mech Corps alone! These still total 125 tanks with a base morale of C. This is the best Russian tank seen in PzC up until this point in the war. The T-34 units have two big advantages.
• Speed – Even in snow conditions these units can threaten large areas of the Axis lines. When used to assault a disrupted Axis position, the T-34c Rgts can still move after the attack a few hexes. If the Germans do not defend in depth, these Soviet tanks will break out and clean your Axis clock!
• Assault value – Most players try to take on the German panzers head to head in shoot outs. The T-34c’s are not best used this way. Assault is the best attack because it is 40% more powerful than direct fire against hard targets like German panzers. (assault value = 14, HA =10/1). Against Axis infantry the assault of 100+ T-34’s is just murder, not combat. Watch this AAR for how RickyB uses his T-34’s. I expect Russian artillery and infantry to fire on the Axis target hex, disrupting the defenders. Then the T-34’s will move up and assault once or split into groups of 50+ and assault twice. Like dynamite, they will blast a hole in a cracked German line.
Friends – Soviet infantry and artillery. Infantry to secure the flanks and mop up as the mechanized forces roll forward. Artillery to crack the Axis defenses.
Enemies – Axis AT guns (75mm and 88mm). 11thPD tanks. German tanks are better quality here. The Russians have to overwhelm them.


Russian infantry – 321st 115th and 333rd Rifle divisions.
Assets – C morale (321st and 115th ID; 333rd RD is D morale). The Russian infantry is good enough to go toe to toe with the German infantry in this scenario. They will rally several times before breaking if handled well and in mass. The 333rd RD is the exception. These guys are just fodder to add to the quality of the 1st Tank Corps defending the Sulatskiy bridgehead.
Liability – Speed. These infantry units are going to have clay feet in all that snow. German units will be able to avoid them for a good part of the scenario, thus negating their numerical superiority and massed fire power.
Friends – Entrenchments and villages on defense. Numbers. There are a lot of Red infantry units. Rotating them on the front of any German attack will be the key to wearing down the less numerous though better quality German infantry. Any cover to reduce the Axis PzGr direct fire will help.
Enemies – German assaults. Once the Axis fatigue and disrupt the Russian infantry, they fall to D or E morale. A concentrated assault at that time will sweep them away.

3rd Guards Cavalry Corps
Assets – Assault value. With a 16 assault value the assaults by the cavalry will be devastating. Thus the Germans must disrupt these units all the time to prevent them combining for a knock out punch on the Axis rear.
Liabilities – Few units. There are only eight regiment sized units in the whole corps. The Germans will need to keep most of these (five or more) out of the line by keeping the Soviet bridgehead small or disrupted so there are traffic jams limiting the number of Soviet cavalry units facing any German defender. If the cavalry do break out, only a strong response form the 11th PD will stop them.
Friends – The small flak units of 3rd Gds Cavalry. These units are speedy “door stops” that can hold a wedge for a turn in a cracked Axis line.
Enemies - PzGr infantry of 11th PD and Axis artillery. The large size but low SA (soft attack) values of the Soviet cavalry means they can not stand up well in a fire fight with equal numbers of German infantry. Artillery will hurt their massed ranks as these are the largest single units in the scenario (425 men) on the Soviet side.

Dog Soldier
Fast is fine, but accuracy is everything.
- Wyatt Earp
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08-23-2008, 08:46 AM,
#6
RE: Dog Fight - Ostkreig Tournament Round 2
German pre game plan.
At start, 04:00AM December 12, 1942
[Image: AtStartGermanview.jpg]
The German mission for this game will be two fold.
1. Do not allow any breakthrough by attacking Russian forces.
2. Destroy the Sulatskiy bridgehead and capture the 250 VP hex. Add as many VP as possible for destroying Russian units.
I will be evacuating the Chir bridgehead starting on the very first turn ( blue arrow). This position to me is untenable by the Axis against a competent Russian opponent. The base of the salient along the Chir river is too small (only six km). The Russians would be able to trap the Axis infantry on the north side of the Chir and add these units as casualty VP quite easily. Such a Russian move would take time and relieve pressure on the Axis forces south of the river. That would be a temporary reprieve and not last more than half the scenario, maybe only until turn ten considering the Russians start the scenario fixed. I feel I will need these infantry to protect the rear of the 11th PD as this unit attempts to drive along the southern bank of the Chir and cut off the Sulatskiy bridgehead. These infantry may even be needed to hold the north western flank of the entire Axis position. The Axis are sort on infantry.

The Axis western flank will retreat by sections. The western most area will retreat quickly as the LW troops are low quality and have little AT capability. I can not do much if RickyB decided to concentrate the T-34’s on the far end of the Axis left flank. By retreating quickly I hope to save the units from easy destruction and avoid contact with the Russian infantry which would disrupt them and make these LW units vulnerable to destruction. To stop the retreat for one unit would be a disaster. The Russians would then disrupt more units resulting in a breakthrough by the mobile forces of the 5th Mech Corps.

In the Sulatskiy bridgehead, I plan a two pronged attack as shown by the red arrows.
One prong lead by PzGr and engineers. They will drive along the Chir river to take the southern end of the engineer bridge (double headed green arrow). This will cause the Russians to abandon the bridgehead or face isolation and destruction adding to my VP total.
The second attack will aim to engage and destroy or cripple with fatigue as many of the 5th tank army or 1st Tank Corps units as I can before they reach the safety of the villages inside the Sulatskiy bridgehead. I expect the Russians to make a stand in those four village hexes which will be dug in and difficult to take if well manned.

The last sector is in the southeast. The Russian 3rd Guard Calvary Corps will be trying to force the river. I will attempt to block their advance with the forces at hand at the choke point where they will be crossing the bridge for as long as possible. I think with careful management of my forces there, I can hold the cavalry without needing more troops until very late (last four turns) of the scenario. That would be my measure of success. I thought about feigning a mistake in my defense there to allow RickyB to get across and try an early breakout. The purpose would be to lure the Soviets west into the open and them smash them against the river with the 11th PD .
I decided this will not work for two reasons.
First. RickyB is a cautious player. He will not throw his units wildly into such a trap. They will stay close together to support each other.
Second. I would have to disengage the 11th PD from the Sulatskiy bridgehead area. This would telegraph my intention and thus spoil the trap. The only way to disengage 11th PD and hide my intentions would be at the time when both the Axis left flank and the southeast flank were collapsing. That would be too risky for me. The 11th PD might destroy the 3rd Gds Cavalry, but find their own rear destroyed thus losing the scenario. To dilute the 11th PD to cover both the Axis left and southeast rear would not leave enough offensive power anywhere to threaten the Soviets.


I know my strategy is not novel. I do hope to execute it very well and thus force RickyB into making a mistake. The Germans can not win this scenario. They can avoiding losing it if the Russians give them a chance by making an error. I will look for such an opportunity.

Dog Soldier
Fast is fine, but accuracy is everything.
- Wyatt Earp
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08-26-2008, 06:40 AM, (This post was last modified: 08-26-2008, 07:01 AM by Ricky B.)
#7
RE: Dog Fight - Ostkreig Tournament Round 2
Dog Soldier put up an excellent summary of the two sides and their forces for this scenario. There is also a supporting KG style unit in play for the Germans the is important for fleshing out the front line.

I will follow up tonight with my initial plan of action, but wanted to post some notes regarding my playtesting of this scenario as the German player against Foul before its approval for HTH play.

1. The German forces, although containing some excellent units and hitting power, are thin on the ground, and the LW units are nearly useless except for holding the frontline so as to delay the Soviet advance.

2. The German bridgehead north of the Chir is very defensible, and actually has a good chance of surviving everything the Soviets can throw at it, unless they pull back their tanks and motorized infantry to push against it. Although easily cut off, the bridgehead has a supply source and so does not go isolated. In testing against Foul, I always tried to hold the bridgehead and it survived in all of our battles. However, as Dog Soldier mentions, these units are probably more important at beefing up the defensive line south of the Chir rather than holding onto the 75 objective points in the bridgehead, and I had decided that if I was going to play German in the tournament, I would give up the bridgehead to use the forces south of the Chir.

3. The Germans always seemed able to compress the central bridgehead but not eliminate it, in all of our tests. I found the key point there was pushing on the Soviets as long as possible then shifting the forces against either or both the cavalry or the western bridgehead, and the timing of the shift was critical or the lines would collapse. Generally, the Soviet forces took such a beating in the center that they were unable to break out against relatively weak screening forces.

4. The western bridgehead can at best be contained, rather than crushed, although significant Soviet losses could be inflicted at times. Trying to stop their advance short of the objectives is vital.

5. The cavalry crossing in the east is dangerous if sufficient reinforcements were not sent in time, as it would allow the front to stretch so far that many more units would be required for the Germans to prevent a hole to open. So holding the front line as long as possible is important there.

My playthroughs as German seemed to follow history fairly consistantly, where the 11th Pz almost had the central bridgehead crushed but had to rush off to then hold back the western forces, the German bridgehead north of the Chir was given up to conserve forces, and the cavalry played a fairly small role in the action.

Rick
[Image: exercise.png]
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08-26-2008, 08:35 AM,
#8
RE: Dog Fight - Ostkreig Tournament Round 2
As this is my edited version of this scenario and Rick has done such an excellent job of summing up the results of our testing, i thought i would just add some background to how this scenario differs from the stock version.

To give the German player the option of defending the bridgehead north of the Chir, i blew all the remaining bridges on the Chir river and increased the minefield density to a strength of 2 and the supply source was increased from 20 to 60.

I lowered the fatigue of the German LW units and placed some of them in TRENCH hex's.

I increased the fatigue of the Russian 5th Mech Corps, started them in a "low fuel" state and fixed them for one turn.

I reduced the scenario by two turns and advised that Programmed Weather should not be used as a storm all but ended the scenario.

VP hex values were also altered, the German VP hex in the Chir bridgehead was reduced from 100 to 75vp, the main German 250vp hex was moved further to the rear to make its capture more difficult for the Russian player.

The Vp level needed for a German victory was reduced by 25 for a minor victory & 100 for a major victory.

All these changes were designed to help the German player have a chance of victory in this scenario, i always felt that if the German player realised that the Russian 3rd Guards Cav Corp must not be allowed to expand its bridgehead in the SE, he would be in with a chance in this game.

As with all scenarios the ability of the opposing players can alter the balance somewhat.

Again i would like to thank Rick for his invaluable input into many of the changes listed above.
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08-26-2008, 01:22 PM,
#9
RE: Dog Fight - Ostkreig Tournament Round 2
Soviet pre game planning and analysis.

Forces available:

Western Bridgehead: 5th Mech Corps at about 80% of full strength, 321st Rifle Div at 85% of full strength (190 man bns).

German Surovikino Bridgehead: covered by the 119th Rifle Div, 90% of full strength (175 man bns).

Central Bridgehead: 1st Tank Corps (overall weak tank strength, still recovering from its beating at State Farm 79 4 days earlier), plus 2 regts of the 333rd Rifle Div at 55% full strength (160 man bn and moderate fatigue).

Eastern Bridgehead: 2 divisions of the 3rd Guards Cav Corps at 65% full strength.

Most of the Soviet forces are C quality, having developed a relatively high experience level prior to and during the Stalingrad operation. They have a large amount of supporting artillery, but ammo is in short supply, and fuel stocks are low. The supply level is fairly low at 60, using VST, resulting in intial frontline supply levels of 55 but dropping as units advance. Thus, I need to plan on fighting without all of my artillery each turn, and with many of my T34s low fuel both at the start and throughout due to the poor supply.

My initial plan is as follows:

[Image: DykePrePlanning.jpg]

It is a conservative plan, designed to isolate the bridgehead north of the Chir if the Germans try to hold it, drive on the key initial objective of Nizhne-Solo'skiy which could trap most of the German forces if I can achieve this.

The cavalry crossing in the east is tricky, as the Germans are just across from the crossing and can fire upon the cavalry crossing the bridge in travel mode. If Dog Soldier shifts the 11th Panzer assets to strike the cavalry it could lead to massive losses, but will relieve the pressure on the other forces.

The central bridgehead, if it can rest, will be able to rebuild some of its strength and then begin its attack, but my expectation is that the 11th Panzer, which starts out nearby, will strike it and force the units to fight for their lives there. My hope is to hold the objective while tying up the cream of the German forces as long as possible, allowing the other two attacks to succeed.

In the west, I have my most important and mobile strike force, but the 5th Mech is low fuel and fixed at the start. I hope the units can recover from low fuel quickly, but it will probably take a few turns for most to do so.

All in all, it is a simple plan that will use my initial divided but powerful forces to try and divert the German forces from using their interior lines to strike and destroy my forces in detail.

Let the battle begin, our forces are ready to continue the attack to throw the Germans out of mother Russia.

Rick
[Image: exercise.png]
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09-02-2008, 05:20 PM,
#10
RE: Dog Fight - Ostkreig Tournament Round 2
German turn 1.
04:00 AM December 12, 1942
Snow Conditions
Night, Visibility 1km.
[Image: VPGT1.jpg]
Victory points after the German turn one.

[Image: GT1.jpg]
I begin the withdrawal from German Chir river bridgehead. The mines and terrain should slow any Russian pursuit. The LW troops in the west fall back to avoid Russian infantry fire when the Russians there become mobile and lose their fixed status in turn two. The LW infantry is slow. The hill to the south is steep. That is why they have to abandon their positions and move on this first turn.
The 11th PD attacks destroying one T-34 unit and forcing back the Russian mechanized infantry. The red arrow shows the assault. Other 11th PD and 338th ID units make contact. The Germans rake the Russians in the Sulatskiy bridgehead with direct and artillery fire attempting to disrupt Russian units slowing their movement in their turn.
In the southeast, 250 motorcyclists of the 11th PD move into the village next to where the Soviet cavalry will cross. An additional 465 men of Alarm Btl Heilmann move up to enter the village next turn. Their HQ occupies their hex to preserve the TRENCH there for later use.

Dog Soldier
Fast is fine, but accuracy is everything.
- Wyatt Earp
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