PBEM Thoughts

Imp · 02-05-2009, 07:13 AM,

Thoughts on mainly play balance as losing the first battle can cause continueing problems.

These assume gentlemans agreements.

Having arty in the core, I am coming to the opinion that only arty integral to the formation should be allowed & should be onboard only or none at all. Your FOOs improve anyway.
The reason if the player with longer ranged offboard includes in his core as its exp goes up so does his CB fire. These units should be bought with support points so luck of the draw still applies. Or at least restrict offboard types

For meetings my view the support points allocated are to high to add variety go with just your core so needs to be balanced or a small amount of support points.

Can do things to like meeting so no time to set up ammo dumps

Something that works quite well, more for MBT is having your support from a diffrent lower quality nation. Adds variety & with ID flags on you know who to rescue because they are in your core.
Using this at moment.
Support as in air or arty can come from either nation not both.
Any additional troops vehicles must be from supporting nation only.

2 big diffrences between a regular battle & a campaign.
Firstly you need to think force preservation from the start, if it all goes tits up you need an exit strategy. A good fighting withdrawl is a very dangerous thing to chase & any unit that makes it off your end lives to see another day.
The other is attacks assaults tend to be easier as the formations tend to be fairly mobile all rounders not defence orientated ATG bristling.

A battle as can sometimes seem to hang & these are my observations to end early.
1) Must control all vic hexes no enemy within 6 or so & generaly ends next turn if enough units lost or offmap. Even if only 1 unit remains game will not end till control all flags.
So no shotgun best thing place on sensible objectives in 3-7 groups or use 3 lump drop.
If you were sad could use this to mop up by not taking one

Have been doing the following
You try to withdraw without saying once its obvious or you have done undetected 2 options.
1) Play nicely allow cease fire player asking for stops all arty & does not press attack. To stop him doing this as realises hes about to bite the bullet the other player can press on that go but at end tries to position himself out of contact. Don't go mad attack like you were going to hes admitted defeat.
2) Skip this but with both go to next point to speed up.
3) Retreating player gives locations of any straglers he thinks you dont know about to kill & says if path to flags clear.
Winner can say paths clear like roads free.
Both pop smoke move out of LOS if poss & if need switch off the odd weapon.
Did that make any sense?

As a balancing aid depending on how badly loser was mauled use any all of the following. Pretty sure winner gets more R&R points.

Winner can only repair damaged units not destroyed or restrict his repair points.
Winner gets no support points next battle or very limited.
Loser gets to go first perhaps with a free turn to take up position, an add hoc delay game. If hes in a real mess let him choose the terrain so if hes lost all armour will probably choose forrest or city.

Because its basic security after first 3 battles if save at end of battle you can reload till get battle type you want.
Its a bit hit & miss but if hes in bad shape an assault would not go amiss.

I seem to have had one to many beers what I have posted is not that clear but general views on anything you have come across.
If you can keep it going past the first 2 battles its great fun managed a 9 battle one so far.

Vesku · 02-06-2009, 05:54 PM,

You have good ideas there. The biggest problem I can see is that the winning side usually destroys more enemy units than the losing side, then the winner gets more rebuild points which makes the second battle even more screwed for the loser. By the third battle the loser has lost any interest to play because he has no hope of even putting up a fight. Restricting winners points or fixing could be a remedy for that.

Playing with very small core is not as much affected by this problem because aux points seem to be 750 pts no matter what size the core is. So, even if you lose the whole 200 pts core you will have a good sized force against enemy even if he has been able to expand his core.

Imp · 02-07-2009, 03:43 AM,

Vesku
Right thats intresting had not noticed support points at 750 always.
Had noticed they are far to high certainly for meetings.
If wanted you could limit as a % so take 5000 core get 10 to 15% support so 500 to 750. If no arty in core this is basicaly your 10% arty rule for meetings.
Thinking about from big campaigns done 750 must be the minimum I have had a lot more

Yes it is very important to approach the game with a diffrent head, your paramount thought should be survival of an effective fighting force. I have started fighting withdrawl as early as turn 6 because the initial exchanges did not go well.
Brings up a whole new tactical picture & if use bounding overwatch with if have to a holding force that in real life would probably surrender you can actualy get back into the game if opponent becomes reckless.
Had one funny large battle in MBT where I started withdrawing but saw an opportunity & launched an offensive taking out 1.5 tank companies, I still withdrew as that did not even things up.
about 8 turns later said you may as well go for objectives I have little on the map. Turns out neither did he that loss put him off any furter action to.
The onus is on the player your force should not end up under half strength Unless your opponents is in a similar state, you should have cut your loses & lived to see another day.

As you say where it falls down is attacker gets more repair than defender it should be the otherway & if allow for this with own rules is a great game.

Hence specifying no to use based on how you think battle ended & adjuting support to if needs makes for a more balanced game.
Also shifting battle type.
Loser shifts 1 to deffence 2 if realy hurt.
so meeting winner attacks then
wins again assaults
draws attacks again
loses goes back in his favour to meeting.
Being able to choose next battle type would be usefull.
What you can do easily produce several maps to play on either random or pregen using bat loc for combatants.
Loser gets to add XX no of trenches to & then load it.

Another option that might intrest people & only used in MBT so far try to see how long you can last.
Set Repair points to max, Soviet I think most Eastern Block do not do R&R like the West they fight till unit is at 1/3rd strength then disband
So do something like USA Cav Brigade takes on Soviet Tank Regiment or equal parts there of.
USA delays or defends depending on if got to position in time & repairs say every 2 battles.
Rusian attack with best equipment with no repair till reduced to 1/3rd
Then replces everything with lower grade equipment hence the need for +20 on repair so

1st Wave Top tanks BMPs Infantry good equipment maybe guards
2nd Wave Average tanks BTRs Infantry average equipment
3rd Wave Old Tanks Trucks conscripts.
Might have 2 first waves but considering shear amount of Russian forces can the Cavalry boys realy do their job & stop the onslaught.
3rd wave might be rubbish but sheer numbers is a serious problem for what you have left I can tell you.

Vesku · 02-07-2009, 03:57 AM,

Sadly the PBEM camp has no flexibility, you can't choose a battle or rebuild points.

I tested with different core points and everytime the aux was 750 and for fourth battle 1500, didn't go further because that was enough for me.

Imp · (This post was last modified: 02-07-2009, 04:20 AM by Imp.)

Vesku Wrote:Sadly the PBEM camp has no flexibility, you can't choose a battle or rebuild points.

I tested with different core points and everytime the aux was 750 and for fourth battle 1500, didn't go further because that was enough for me.

Yes as it stands players need to agree & work out most of the details which is a shame because it has great potentiol & produces markedly diffrent battles. What to do with all that transport that has been invaluable till now when you are defending for instance.

Another thing that changes battles but think mainly preaching to a WW2 audience here is allowing scouts to do there job. Does not make such a big diffrence in WW2 but something like first 2 turns only units that can move are say 8 scouts 1 platoon of supporting infantry & 2 ATGM with respective transport. For meetings no arty air to be plotted till other side is found. This ups the tension quite a bit & if let a FOO go to means when arty comes in it comes in pretty hard normaly.
Couse you have to trust the other player but you are trying to expand on engagement types available

Weasel · 02-07-2009, 06:32 AM,

Vesku Wrote:Sadly the PBEM camp has no flexibility, you can't choose a battle or rebuild points.

I tested with different core points and everytime the aux was 750 and for fourth battle 1500, didn't go further because that was enough for me.

You got 1500 for our fourth Cdn Vs Finn battle? I didn't, I got 750 and then I sold all my heavy tanks for Shermans to get more points.