Petition: John Tiller - Remove DRM Kharkov 43

[Dirk Gross]

Yeah, it can be a big deal. I currently have about 50 HPS titles installed on my computer, and probably a dozen or so on my laptop for when I'm away on business. Deleting one game and patching it up may only take ten minutes or so. After more titles are released, it would take hours to move a dozen games over and patch them. And it's needless. I also have more than a dozen downloaded Matrix games that use a key that allows installs on both my desktop and laptop. Somehow Matrix Games survive with a key without the "phone home" DRM.

Sign me up for the petition. I own all the titles of all the series (except the naval ones), but it ends here until the key system is made similar to the Matrix Games system.

Consider my petition withdrawn. The change to two installs satisfies me.

[Glenn Saunders]

That's what Im doing too. Im buying all the games I can from NWS. I will never have to worry about Tiller calling it quits, him killing the DRM server and me being stuck with some game I cant even install.

First of all you have to get any of the previous games on CD from somewhere as those titles are currently not avaialble for downlaod.

If when the CD stock runs out, then a decision will be made whether to burn more CDs and sell the old way, or make a digital download.

Have you even seen TWO different copies oa the same book by different publishers? I suppose that could happen here too.

As for Tiller calling it quits - sure that could happen - and I could Buy a Mac someday too - but both are about as likely as me getting hit by falling space junk.

John Tiller has been around for a long time and I ask you to list anyone with more games that are still being sold and supported as his products are.

So give me a break. I've been with John more than 10 years myself. We're in this thing for the long haul. Not sure what else I can say or point to that will prove that.

Glenn

[Assault]

As for Tiller calling it quits - sure that could happen - and I could Buy a Mac someday too - but both are about as likely as me getting hit by falling space junk.

Glenn

My friend, stranger things than those *have happened ~

[Jazman]

As for Tiller calling it quits - sure that could happen - and I could Buy a Mac someday too - but both are about as likely as me getting hit by falling space junk.

Glenn

My friend, stranger things than those *have happened ~

Heart attacks, strokes, accidents are sad, but they are quite common. God forbid that anything like that happen to Mr. Tiller anytime soon, but it happens to us all, some sooner, some later. I'm just being realistic.

[Glenn Saunders]

Heart attacks, strokes, accidents are sad, but they are quite common. God forbid that anything like that happen to Mr. Tiller anytime soon, but it happens to us all, some sooner, some later. I'm just being realistic.

[Sarcastic remarks on]
Of course you are right - best not invest that $40 in something as risky a venture as this.

Invest it in a game of golf this summer, or maybe a movie for two, some pop corn and maybe a hamburger and a beer. Much better long term value. And no risk. I know I've never seen a movie I didn't like.[Sarcastic remarks off]

I am truly sorry if these remarks have offended anyone. $40 is eight hours pay at $5 an hour.

It is a lot of money but to anyone who enjoys these types of games, - like teh guys who post here - it will provide hours and hours of entertainment and I feel pretty good about thinking it is a good deal. It is a quality product that has taken a great deal of hours to create.

If you get the game and you have a problem with your PC, you might need to contact support - and I believe John Tiller and the people around him have a long proven track record is supporting the games and his customers.

From the website

Q: But what if my old computer crashes first and I can't uninstall the game?

A: In that case, you would need to request a manual deactivation from support. Once they do that for you, you can then install the game on the new computer.

Q: Activation requires that I be able to connect to the John Tiller Software server over the Internet. What happens if John Tiller Software goes out of business and there isn't a server to connect to?

A: We have been developing computer wargames since 1995 and almost all of the products developed since that time are still being sold and supported. We have demonstrated a unique ability to remain in the challenging wargame industry for the long term, but if what you say does happen, it is our commitment to our customers to release updates to all of our products that would not require activation.

If you do NOT believe this, then there is little more anyone can do except suggest you try one of the existing titles, I hope to have a patch for Budapest '45 in the next few days. It runs from CD and does not require activation.

Glenn

[Assault]

Heart attacks, strokes, accidents are sad, but they are quite common. God forbid that anything like that happen to Mr. Tiller anytime soon, but it happens to us all, some sooner, some later. I'm just being realistic.

Of course you are right - best not invest that $40 in something as risky a venture as this.

Invest it in a game of golf this summer, or maybe a movie for two, some pop corn and maybe a hamburger and a beer. Much better long term value. And no risk. I know I've never seen a movie I didn't like.

To state on here that this *is a risky venture is not at all reassuring for customers. And if being sarcastic you are doing a disservice to customers by invalidating their concerns.

[Mr Grumpy]

OK enough is enough, never in my wildest dreams did i think we would be discussing the future demise of JT on this forum (joking or not), so no more of this type of posting please as it will be removed and the thread locked down.

[Ricky B]

Heart attacks, strokes, accidents are sad, but they are quite common. God forbid that anything like that happen to Mr. Tiller anytime soon, but it happens to us all, some sooner, some later. I'm just being realistic.

Of course you are right - best not invest that $40 in something as risky a venture as this.

Invest it in a game of golf this summer, or maybe a movie for two, some pop corn and maybe a hamburger and a beer. Much better long term value. And no risk. I know I've never seen a movie I didn't like.

To state on here that this *is a risky venture is not at all reassuring for customers. And if being sarcastic you are doing a disservice to customers by invalidating their concerns.

Assault, if you feel that Glenn's comments (obviously sarcastic, not sure why you felt the need to treat it as his real thoughts, you knew what he was saying) are a very valid way of putting your and other's concerns into his perspective. He didn't invalidate them in any way, you have concerns, they are valid and Glenn didn't say they aren't - I have my concerns about the games in general, which is when Microsoft puts up 2 more operating systems and my current PC dies, will the PzC games run on the latest without updates at all, thus killing the program in at least as likely a scenario as if JTS (the software company) has gone into a very unlikely bankruptcy.

So pick your poison, everyone has concerns at some level, and each person has, as Glenn has stated, the opportunity to vote with his wallet re these concerns and what that person considers the likelihood of them occuring, or as Glenn put into perspective, also the cost of something bad happening.

As I stated above, I figure I have 30 years of gaming left in me - by the time I am 80 I may not be able to run computers any longer, or maybe figure I will have grown up anyway :). By that time, I am 95% sure that without updates, the current HPS PzC games will not run on the computers of that time, and that my current PC will be dead. Same goes for my other software. So whether it carries me through another 10 years of playing PzC games that I bought, or 20 or miraculously through the next 30, I will take what I got but knowing that sooner or later the games won't be working for me for whatever reason.

As to those that raised a concern with a JTS (the company) bankruptcy, give that some real thought. Although possible, how likely is it? The company has got to have fairly low overhead - a server, high speed internet connection, or more likely a colocated server at a facility with tons of open bandwidth, etc. As I assume John Tiller created his store himself, I would guess their is no ongoing cost to maintain the store. So what ongoing costs does he have that could drive his company into bankruptcy? I doubt there is a loan for all this - possible but if so it would be small, so I discount this completely. He has whatever method of getting his server on the internet, I would guess an colocate facility which is the most expensive. He might be paying $500 per month for that, I have a work server colocated for a tenth that but our bandwidth needs run quite a bit less than JTS, I am sure - but that should still provide a huge pipe and actualy bytes transferred in games downloaded. I can't think of any other costs. I don't know that JTS has any actual employees outside of JT himself, Glenn would know but my guess is Glenn and others are contractors so there is minimal risk of back payroll taxes sinking the company if this is it for corporate obligations. So while this might be a concern, the liklihood of a bankruptcy is almost vanishingly small in my mind. And as the developer and owner of the software, that means that JTS would almost definitely be able to carry out the promise of unlocking the DD games.

Rick

[-72-]

^ Raises some interesting points. It are just those exact points about overhead, that to me makes some comments completely invalid, not to mention uniformed about the nature of businesses and e-commerce.

[papajack]

Picture this , if you have 12 JTS games install in your PC and then your pC die on you ...what happen then ??

Give you another activation for all the 12 games ?

How JTS going to determine whether you are genuine or not ..what if you are trying install to additional computer ?

So if my PC crash and I just request for additional key ? is it that easy ?

Then I have to pray my PC will never die again or lost my laptop or can I request my 12 keys again ??

Is there a written agreement that guarantee this ? or do I have to beg for additional keys ?

or all my games will be gone forever ??

and yes until this uncertainty is remove , I am all for the petition