.PDT values in PzC

[JDR Dragoon]

In the latest DF85 patch, the follwing extras was added:

- Added new Bunker and Mine Prob Parameter Data Values and allowing
non-bridge engineer units to construct Bunkers.

- Added new Night Move Disruption parameter data value which determines
probability of night movement by non-rail and non-travel or
non-road movement units causing Disruption.

Yet, none of the scenarios has had their .pdt files upgraded to reflect this.

So I was wondering which values are assigned to these sections in the PzC games in order to get some kind of yardstick to work with.

I know that the Bunker Prob for Kharkov 43 is 5% (deliberately set low according to the designers notes), but what of the other recent PzC titles (Tunisia 43, Moscow 42)?

Night Move Disruption made its debut w. Tunisia 43, but I have been unable to find the percentage in any of the designers notes. Can anybody help?

Of course, if scenarios for the older PzC games have had their .pdts updated with the relevant values after the recent patches, feel free to post the information here as well (Bunker Prob and Night Move Disruption parameter data).

[raizer]

IMO Depends on the game and cannot be a fixed value across the board.

When Night D came to bulge Ricky B and I went with 15% I think-a good compromise for the germans who are hard pressed for time, and we did this on the shorter games as well. Since then, I'm playing 2 campaign alt mirror games and we have kept it at 15% and this seems like a very good setting.

In a campaign team game of F40 we have it set for 30%

In M42 its set for 60%-this is a must for the summer what if games, It has to be high to prevent the germans from moving out too much at night and this is good for the winter games-no way troops were moving non road in that cold weather, at night, in good order.

But for El-Alemain Id set it low, Salerno High, etc one could go on and on.

Bunkers have to be off in bluge. A buddy of mine and I had them on by accident at a low %-maybe 5. On one turn he had a bunker over the crossing at Stavelot-not good for the germans, and a few other popped up. So we had to restart with the value at 0.

[JDR Dragoon]

Thanks for your insights. Although I was fishing for the values in the stock .pdts, learning about what other scenario designers have done (and why) is of course always illuminating :)

[Compass Rose]

raizer,

If I am following you correctly, the values you stated that you have used, is that what is offered in the updates or is that something that you and your opponent come to an agreement upon, along with optional rules, before you play a scenario?

Thanks

[Volcano Man]

I can tell you the values that I use for Modern Campaigns (Alt scenarios)...

Night disruption = 30% (60% is the normal for PzC, so here it is half due to modern communications and night optics, etc).

Bunker building = 3% (again, typically twice higher than PzC which is usually around 1.5%)

Mine laying = typically half the % for digging in

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Of course, use whatever values you want but these should give you an idea of a start point.

[raizer]

Ah good question-the values for Night D and bunkers have all been agreed upon b4 starting the game...Just as with optional rules, opponents should have a reasonable discussion about these settings before any game and know why the values are set at a particular # and how those #'s will influence the game.

But both bunker and Night D values can influence the game greatly. For example, if you have any bunker probability in a very good balanced game like, say Piepers scenario in Bulge 44, it'll just turn the game on its head if any bunkers are ever built by those very numerous and very mobile american engineers.

[JDR Dragoon]

I must again thank everybody for their insights regarding their personal preferences and the manner in wich this influences the way they play the game. It is of course very helpful to understand why people choose the way they do when designing/modifying the .pdt file for a scenario. But I am looking for the stock .pdt values for each Panzer Campaign title that has either started its career with these values included in their .pdts or has seen them retroactively added in a later (and official) upgrade to the .pdt and scenarios. In case the values differ (for instance between Tunisia 43 and Moscow 42), this is fine as well.

In short: I want the raw unabridged stock numbers for each individual title with these values (Night Move Disruption and Bunker Probability, and also Mine probability as well, provided that it is something else than just 50% of the digging in value) in effect.

*EDIT*
I am of course also interested if these values differ within a title (there might be different Bunker Probabilities in the Summer and Winter scenarios in Moscow 42, I don´t know), since it will give me more of a baseline to work with.

[76mm]

Dragoon, surprised that no one has responded yet; here are the values for M42 winter (I'll post the summer values later if no one has done so already):

Bunker Prob: 0.5% per turn
Night Move Disruption: 60%
Digging In and Mine Prob both @ 5%

[JDR Dragoon]

Prekrasnij. This was excactly what I was hoping for.

[76mm]

Dragoon,

In M42 Summer, all the values are the same except Digging-In, which is 10%.

---

In Budapest 45, interesting differences:

Digging-In: 10%
Mine: 5%
Bunker Prob: 0%
Night Move Disruption: 0% (!)

Same in Mius 43 and Minsk 44.

That's all I've got, man.