Some thoughts on tthese game

Landser34 · 04-08-2017, 01:15 AM,

I have been playing these games for awhile one of my gripes pet peeves is that to many times you either have to completely wipe out a unit or get it down to one or two men before it disrupts or breaks very rarely did units fight to the last man before units would withdraw from the position.I wish this series and Panzer campaigns also would have just like the Civil Wargames if a unit took so many casualties the whole brigade had a chance to rout. because in most battles if you wiped out the better part of a company or battalion the rest of the troops are not going to stay in place and fight to the last man maybe the only country you coould say would do that are the Japanese.

enigma6584 · 04-08-2017, 04:08 AM,

I've only recently gotten back into these fantastic games but I have noticed this myself. Was working to take a position which was being fought for very hard for and noticed I only was able to disrupt the enemy unit when there was only 4 troops left. Did surprise me.

wiggum · (This post was last modified: 04-08-2017, 05:50 AM by wiggum.)

(04-08-2017, 01:15 AM)Landser34 Wrote: one of my gripes pet peeves is that to many times you either have to completely wipe out a unit or get it down to one or two men before it disrupts

I 100% agree !

I have pointed this out long ago. Units tend to fight till death and often will only disrupt when they already lost like 50% of their men.
Not realistic.
Also, even if they disrupt sooner, you click "end turn" and they are fine again.
Broken status is as rare as a win in the lottery and usually the unit is down to 1 tank or 2-3 (out of 50 or 30) men already when it happens.
As i said many times...at this scale, the game NEEDS a SUPRESSED status !

So the flow should be like:

fired upon and taken casualties -> Supressed for the current and possible next turn (x% chance for being supressed in next turn too)
Lost more then 25% of original strength -> PERMANENTLY DISRUPTED until not fired upon for x turns and close to a HQ
Lost more then 50% of original strength -> PERMANENTLY BROKEN
Lost more then 75% of original strengh -> REMOVED FROM MAP and counted as MIA and x% of stranglers added to friendly units in radius of x hex
of course, this would mean all scenarios have to be redone and playtested again.

wiggum · 04-08-2017, 05:51 AM,

(04-08-2017, 04:08 AM)enigma6584 Wrote: I've only recently gotten back into these fantastic games but I have noticed this myself. Was working to take a position which was being fought for very hard for and noticed I only was able to disrupt the enemy unit when there was only 4 troops left. Did surprise me.

Sadly, currently the flow of action is unrealistic in Panzer Battles...can only hope they will fix it.

fastphil · 04-08-2017, 06:52 AM,

This is particular true when surrounded in fortifications. If I get them disrupted , I open a retreat path then assault. Sometimes even if not disrupted.

wiggum · 04-08-2017, 07:05 PM,

(04-08-2017, 06:52 AM)fastphil Wrote: This is particular true when surrounded in fortifications. If I get them disrupted , I open a retreat path then assault. Sometimes even if not disrupted.

This game could be so much more.

For example, surrounded troops could have a x% chance per turn to surrender based on Moral, Unit Size, Status (Disrupted, Broken) and Fatigue.

Strela · 04-09-2017, 11:22 PM,

All,

We introduced in the last round of patches as well as the new Demo a new parameter setting called 'Fatigue Factor'.

We found that there was an error created in the game series when ported from Panzer Campaigns where fatigue accumulation was 2/3rd's of what it should be. This directly allowed small units to never accumulate enough fatigue to regularly disrupt or break.

We did not want to permanently change the originally released games (Kursk & Normandy) as they had all been tested with the existing values. We did use the correct values for the Demo and for PzB 3.

Under the PDT file Kursk and Normandy have a Fatigue factor of 2. In the Demo and later titles it is 3. This aligns with the fatigue accumulation formulas in PzC.

You can actually test this easily without changing anything. The Kursk getting started scenario is also in the Demo. Both use different values. You will note in the Demo that even the SS will disrupt, much more regularly than in Kursk.

So if you want a more realistic disruption rate for the first two games, just change the Fatigue factor from 2 to 3.

You will notice the difference...

David

Jagger · (This post was last modified: 04-10-2017, 12:29 AM by Jagger.)

Ok, I thought I would test a change to the fatigue factor. I did a search for PDT files and found four of them. One is the PBNormandy.pdt file. Unfortunately my computer to refuses to open a PDT file. Is there some sort of special software required to open these PDT files?

Jagger · 04-10-2017, 12:37 AM,

(04-10-2017, 12:27 AM)Jagger Wrote: Ok, I thought I would test a change to the fatigue factor. I did a search for PDT files and found four of them. One is the PBNormandy.pdt file. Unfortunately my computer to refuses to open a PDT file. Is there some sort of special software required to open these PDT files?

Are right. I figured it out. Anybody else wondering, you need to use the pbparam application within the Battles of Normandy Folder. Do a search in your game folder to find it. Open it and then select whatever pdt file you wish to modify. Make a copy of original. Fatigue factor is under miscellaneous values near the top.