How does the defense value work?

[NikolaiB]

Hi! In my current games, I am trying to find out when I should assault, when I should fire and if I do fire, at what range. So, I am trying to understand the games engine combat resolution. After reading the manual, I have three quick questions.

(1) How does the defense value work in firing calculations? In section 11 (combat results), there is no mention of the targets defense value. Does it actually not apply?

(2) For assault calculations, it is mentioned that the attackers assault value is compared to the defenders defense value. However, I am not sure what the exact calculation is.

(3) In the armored effectiveness calculation, does the engine use the pure Hard Attack value, before any modifications from range or terrain? Alternatively, are those factors taken into account to determine which of the two cases is applied.

Thank you!

[Jeff Conner]

Nicolaiss

You really want Green to answer these questions as he is the master of things complicated. But in the meantime, I will try and answer.

The appropriate fire value, modified for range, is multiplied by the strength of the unit (guns and vehicles are multiplied by ten to make them the equivalent of men). This value is then increased or decreased by any modifiers. The attack value is then divided by the target's defense value, again being adjusted for any appropriate modifiers. This value is then multiplied by the low and high values (found in the parameter data) and then divided by 10000. The fire result is determined by the selection of a random number between the high and low values.

The assault rules work pretty much the same way. However, there are two calculations in assaults, one for casualties caused by the attacker and another for those caused by the defender. There are also two sets of high and low values, one for attacker and another for the defender. If you examine these, you will see that if both sides are equal, the defender will cause about twice the losses that he would suffer. So, be sure you have numbers on your side before committing to an assault.

I am not positive on the last question, but I believe that it is the unmodified values that are used in the armored effectiveness calculation and that the range and other modifiers do not play a part in the calculation of this modifier.

Jeff

[Xerxes77]

Hi! In my current games, I am trying to find out when I should assault, when I should fire and if I do fire, at what range. So, I am trying to understand the games engine combat resolution. After reading the manual, I have three quick questions.

(1) How does the defense value work in firing calculations? In section 11 (combat results), there is no mention of the targets defense value. Does it actually not apply?

(3) In the armored effectiveness calculation, does the engine use the pure Hard Attack value, before any modifications from range or terrain? Alternatively, are those factors taken into account to determine which of the two cases is applied.

Thank you!

Hi NikolaiB,

The relevant line in the manual is under the chapter 5 paragraph on "Basic Fire Resolution":
"The combat value used is the modified attack value of the firing unit divided by the modified defense value of the target unit."

So you can see the Defense value of the target is central to the combat value calculation. That line does tend to get lost in the sea of information, doesn't it? I've been there. I understand there's an effort underway to update the manuals; I hope they'll include a bunch of examples on basiic firing like they did with the supply section

(Strangely, considering its importance and relevance to this section, the Combat Results chapter appears near the end of the manual).

3) Yes, the pure Hard Attack value is used for the calculation of armored effectiveness, which is in itself a modification to the Fire Value.

[NikolaiB]

Thank you Xerxes77 and Jeff Conner! Oh man, bummed that I missed it in the manual.

[Green]

You really want Green to answer these questions as he is the master of things complicated.  But in the meantime, I will try and answer.

Thanks, Jeff. You know me too well. I really can take anything, no matter how simple and make it seem complicated. Pity I could not get to this question quickly enough to work my magic. 

John

[NikolaiB]

Just one more question. In one of the scenarios that I am playing, there are these one tank HQ units. They have attack and assault values and don't seem to act like typical HQs. However, they appear to die very easily, even though they have the same defense values as the normal tank units.

So, my question is, how does the Finishing Off rule apply to them? As they represent one tank (10 men), this made me think the rule does not apply to them. However, they just seem to die so easily that I want to double check.

PS. I also feel like this rule should be mentioned in the attack/assault modifiers section too.

Thank you for the help!

[Green]

Just one more question. In one of the scenarios that I am playing, there are these one tank HQ units. They have attack and assault values and don't seem to act like typical HQs. However, they appear to die very easily, even though they have the same defense values as the normal tank units.

So, my question is, how does the Finishing Off rule apply to them? As they represent one tank (10 men), this made me think the rule does not apply to them. However, they just seem to die so easily that I want to double check.

PS. I also feel like this rule should be mentioned in the attack/assault modifiers section too.

Thank you for the help!

The units you are referring to are actually just normal tank units in terms of the game. If you highlight HQ's (using the L hotkey) presumably they are not highlighted. It will simply be the unit designation.

Finishing off applies to units with less than 10 men, so it is not relevant here.

Tanks actually have low defense values generally but are Hard targets. Without more details it is impossible to know what you mean by 'die very easily'. They will certainly die easily if assaulted.