Spotting Oddities

[Hobbes]

Hi folks, a few times recently I have had a unit with los on a handful of clear terrain hexes only with no enemy units visible.
The next turn however I have had enemy units move up and attack the unit without bumping into it first. The unit had all op fire settings off.

Is it possible to have enemy units move into clear terrain without being spotted? Otherwise I can't explain this other than an error on my part.

Cheers, Chris

[Von Earlmann]

it usually means the units spotted yours on that turn...........a spotting check is done every turn.

[Hobbes]

Maybe this is why I lose so many games. I still don't understand this!

If I have a unit in the same place for many turns and it can only see a few clear terrain hexes there is a chance it will be able to be attacked before it is able to spot an enemy unit?

[Von Earlmann]

Usually if they move into your los you will spot them first..............but they will have a spotting role on the next turn........otherwise they have to bump your units to be seen during that turn...........only exception I know of is if the enemy was there before you were........or dare I say..... the turn is being replayed

[Hobbes]

I don't think there is any cheating going on here. If a turn was replayed it wouldn't allow a player to attack units that were not spotted. I can only think that I have made mistakes here or a bug in the spotting code.
Most likely a mistake somehow I think.

Cheers, Chris

[John Given]

Hey Hobbs, I have a few things to add to this. LOS issues will make or break you in this game.

a. Sometimes, the enemy will be spotting you, and you don't even realize it. That would explain how he's attacking you in the same turn from your "hidden" position.

b. Sometimes, people refuse to watch the replay, and during the replay, a jeep (or whatever) moved up to your hidden unit, revealed its location, and moved away. Always be sure to watch the replay.

c. Sometimes, the enemy will blind-fire their artillery into your hidden unit's hex. Rockets are especially devastating when used for blind shelling. I remember one time KK Rossokowski's rockets hit my unspotted trucks (he likes blind-shelling too :stir:), and I checked the details - a whopping 18 attack factors were going into the attack, not the usual two or three. If your unit retreats as a result of this into enemy los, it will become spotted.

d. Last but not least, some players in high-visibility scenarios will not "zoom-out" enough. I often switch from view 1 to view 4, to make sure distant hilltops can't see that hex I may be moving my loaded trucks into. The scenario "Hedgerow Inferno" is a perfect example of a scen where you could swear that nothing can see your hidey-hole, when in fact, an OFF-SCREEN hex far away can see you just fine. Of course with my luck, that's the hex with an enemy spotter in it.

Hope this helps.

[Hobbes]

Hi John, thanks for you comments.

For B. It's possible but very unlikely. I do watch the replays but on fast opponent. My opponent doesn't play in this style and had nothing near enough to do this.

C. Yes this has happened to me but in the case I'm referring to the damage was done by direct fire.

D. I zoomed out and in a few times. I looked at every possible hex!

I don't want to make a big deal out of this, I was just wondering if anyone else had ever found problems with spotting.

[Hobbes]

I just had a look on my old laptop and found the file I sent to my opponent.
When the game is finished I will ask him to take a look at the turn so we can work out how the units were spotted. I will probably find that he had a unit hidden somewhere but It will be interesting to find out how. I'll update this post and probably look like an idiot when I do :)

Cheers, Chris

[zeiss]

It's certainly possible that enemy units can remain hidden in clear hexes. If they were there before you got LOS to the hex. Recently I even had an enemy light tank (may have been an AC) hiding in a clear LOS hex. Quite a surprise when I bumped in to it.

Full strength artillery fire is a sure sign of a hidden spotter..

A possibly related LOS question is: Does the scenario's Visibility affect the chance of spotting units or does it only affect the LOS range?

[McIvan]

I think it only affects the LOS range.

It's quite possible for a low SP infantry unit to be sitting somewhere back at the limits of LOS and stay concealed for several turns. It depends how many of your units have reciprocal LOS....if its only the one, then you're probably trying to roll a 1/10 chance every turn to spot it. So anyways, some miserable infty unit has LOS, which allows a powerful enemy unit to roll into range, blast you, and scoot away. Painful :(