Franco-Prussian War of 1870-71?

[Stephen]

Could the elegant First World War system be engineered further back in time to create a game with several operational scenarios of the Franco-Prussian War? I believe the time and space scale would work, though the relative firepower and assualt strengths could be inverted - French with better rifle firepower and Germans/Prussians with better assault strength. Perhaps a few mitrailleuse thrown in as bling, same operationally as machine-guns. Wonder how direct fire artillery and cavalry strengths would differ? Imagine a 300+ turn campaign scenario covering eastern France?

[Volcano Man]

Perhaps, there seems to be some interest there, so you never know. I always like that conflict and the Russo-Japanese War, so maybe after I clone myself I can work on those. ;)

[Xaver]

I dont say no to a 1870 title but i think that napoleonic/civil war engine is better to simulate the war style... i see WWI engine better to cover conflict between WWI (maybe the 1910 wars can enter here) and WWII... i think in 1920 war between Poland and Soviets and spanish civil war (maybe the best option if all be in a single title... Assault over Madrid, Guadalajara, Jarama, Brunente, Teruel...)... the Jarama mod for example is one of the very few total conversions for PzC and works fine using PzC engine.

I know that Tiller maybe is working in a 1700-1800 game (a mod was retired by his petition) and never say if he is going to cover XIX colonial and non colonial conflicts after napoleonic period.

[Elxaime]

I dont say no to a 1870 title but i think that napoleonic/civil war engine is better to simulate the war style.

I could see the American Civil War engine being used for:

- the Crimean War - 1853-1855
- the Second Italian War of Unification - 1859
- the Austro-Prussian War - 1866
- the Franco-Prussian War - 1871
- the Russo-Turkish War of 1877-1878
- the Spanish-American War - 1898
- the Second Boer War 1899-1900 (field battle period)
- the Russo-Japanese War of 1905
- the Mexican Revolution 1910-1917 period

Things might start breaking down near the end of this period though in some conflicts, as advances in artillery had made indirect fire much more effective. Machine guns could probably still be used without new rules since they were still treated like artillery batteries in these periods.

[Volcano Man]

I think you guys are looking at it the wrong way. It is not a case of "either or", rather, both engines could certainly represent the conflict in different ways. The Napoleonic engine is a bit more tactical because the scale is smaller, but in that engine you can't easily represent several tied together campaigns in the Napoleonic engine very well, just set piece battles. Luckily though, the Napoleonic War had campaigns stretched out quite a bit chronologically, but the Franco-Prussian War could be done both ways. In other words, I think there would be room for both to co-exist. ;)

[Hoplite]

Additionally Balkan wars can be on the list. (1913)
Polish-Soviet and the ones with high unit density and maneuver battles of Russian civil war can be very good. I think ww1 engine will be good to simulate those with machine guns and cavalry charge with all adequate mechanics to play those games like in Fr'14

[Xaver]

Well, the napoleonic scale is the same as in F14, battalion level with no company split... BUT napoleonic engine have the skirmishers option something that was used in XIX (and you can use to simulate many actions where detached small units do very well) and you need have in mind that units have flanks and rear unlike in F14/PzC/MC engines something that reduce a lot the tactical factor more important in XIX than in XX after WWI tomb of line formations... maybe a Nap engine meets ACW engine could be the best option because you have all you need for 1870... indirect arty was important here but not as in WWI, practically all arty were direct and MG influence was very small except in colonial wars in late XIX... and for this i think that an improved EAW engine could be better because scalle is very small and Nap engine with company level doesnt works as in EAW (column is only to move, you cant shoot or assault on it and you can move more in line without Disrupted like in Nap titles).

Time and terrain scale... well, is a question of adapt it in big campaign and leave nap/ACW scales for tactical battles but maybe here is a question of what kind of campaign you want, if you want a F14 campaign mode yes, the PzC/F14 engine is better if you want sacrifice the tactical factor.

Maybe we talk about wars that need a new engine except the ones between WWI and WWII that have in F14 engine a great one... and of course you can add some pre WWI wars.

For me i allways want see a Spanish civil war title because is the perfect mix of WWI and WWII with a good selection of battles and unlike the SB title at the battalion level works a lot better i allways find SB civil war bad for this.

[Volcano Man]

Yes, indeed, I was talking about the map and time scale. ;) Both engines have their strengths and weaknesses, yes.

[Liebchen]

Yes!

Cloning VolcanoMan!

Brilliant idea!

I say do it twice!

Perhaps, there seems to be some interest there, so you never know. I always like that conflict and the Russo-Japanese War, so maybe after I clone myself I can work on those. ;)